|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 11:05:43 GMT -5
Post by deathfromabove on Jan 10, 2018 11:05:43 GMT -5
I'm afraid you guys have got things right here in Norwalk. I guess we have got or getting more snowflakes here than what I thought. If these parents think that Steve is a bully or as I like to call it "a tough coach" they should have their snowflakes at St. Paul's and Coach Livengood. There they are really tough on the kids and boy to they swear up a storm. If the coaches are grabbing the kids jersey and moving him a few feet, to me that means the snowflake is out of position and has been more than once. The last year that I coach football, the HC came up to me and said a parent or two came to him and said I was to ruff on their little snowflakes by making them run to much. Run to much, if they only knew, in my days , and I know I'm living in the past again, we ran and we ran. Getting on us players now only toughen us up and getting us ready for what real live was involve. We had to get ready for either collage and it's fast pace or for the world of the job and maybe a family with the pressure that comes with that. For some of us their was also military and fast pace and pressure of that comes a lot worst than what college or family and a job can bring, not to mention the possibility of war and the horrors of it. Yes if these kids can not take what a coaches are giving out than these snowflakes WILL NOT succeed in life. I'm proof of that and I AM PROUD of what my coaches did for me to be somebody who can survive in life. And to Coach Grey and Coach Mac stick to your guns, oops wrong thing to say, anyway stick with it and don't let the snowflakes momma boys or one jacka$$ board member run you out.
|
|
|
Post by sport24278 on Jan 10, 2018 11:19:20 GMT -5
Did either mommy mention their boys partying in the offseason (1 had to sit out football games and the other had to sit out basketball games).
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 11:50:49 GMT -5
Post by deathfromabove on Jan 10, 2018 11:50:49 GMT -5
Thankfully Bob Haas coached in the 20th Century or snowflakes like Mary would have called him a bully. I think most people are missing the point here. I do not know coach Gray or this parent but what I can tell you is we cannot look to past actions and apply them to today's situations. The laws have changed and so have the parent's input and responsibilities. Soft has nothing to do with most of these situations, it is against the law to place your hands on someone out of anger. There is no difference if a teacher grabs a kid and jerks him or her out of the seat out of anger. Why the anger, does it get results, rarely in this day and age. Companies push harassment and tolerance in the work place and the school system should be held to the same standard, my believe is actually higher than the standard, they are educating our kids after all. School should be a safe haven and for a coach or teacher to get angry to a point where they have to act out physically, try that in the work place and see what happens. We talk about teaching kids lessons, how about patience. We talk about teaching kids things that they can take into adulthood, screaming and yelling is the lesson to be taught? You can say what you want but it takes a brave parent to step up like this, after all it is her right to voice her opinion. For the school board to blow her off and act like she is being bothersome, they need to remember who voted them in and the can be voted out. Moneyball, I know at times you and I have disagree on things and at times we have. Yes it is against the law to place your hands on someone in anger but in this case I don't think Steve was doing this in anger but maybe a little ticked off because some kids are uncoachable. He probably was told several times on where he should be but wasn't listening or he might was thinking that he knows more than the coach. Some parents should also either get documentations of the abuse or keep their noses out of it and accept that little johnny is a lousy basketball player and someone who doesn't listen to the coaches. When I coached my sons I was really hard on my sons more than what I was on their teammates. My sons knew what life was coming at them and they knew that they had to be ready for it like I was. Sorry if we disagree on this Moneyball but this is how I think it should be. Still friends I hope.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 12:09:12 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by greenman on Jan 10, 2018 12:09:12 GMT -5
Thankfully Bob Haas coached in the 20th Century or snowflakes like Mary would have called him a bully. I think most people are missing the point here. I do not know coach Gray or this parent but what I can tell you is we cannot look to past actions and apply them to today's situations. The laws have changed and so have the parent's input and responsibilities. Soft has nothing to do with most of these situations, it is against the law to place your hands on someone out of anger. There is no difference if a teacher grabs a kid and jerks him or her out of the seat out of anger. Why the anger, does it get results, rarely in this day and age. Companies push harassment and tolerance in the work place and the school system should be held to the same standard, my believe is actually higher than the standard, they are educating our kids after all. School should be a safe haven and for a coach or teacher to get angry to a point where they have to act out physically, try that in the work place and see what happens. We talk about teaching kids lessons, how about patience. We talk about teaching kids things that they can take into adulthood, screaming and yelling is the lesson to be taught? You can say what you want but it takes a brave parent to step up like this, after all it is her right to voice her opinion. For the school board to blow her off and act like she is being bothersome, they need to remember who voted them in and the can be voted out. Ah, the ol' "we're the boss, we pay your salary" chestnut. Never gets old. Wait, I tell a lie, I meant it gets old real fast. Just because you vote doesn't mean you're right. Can you prove that the coach physically touched someone, i.e., corroboration by credible witnesses, surveillance footage? Can you cite one of those "new laws" you speak of? Gray might have been upset, and may have grabbed a player by the jersey to move him into position, doing so a little harder perhaps than said porcelain-doll player is used to. Unnecessary if lil' Johnny had his mind on the task at hand instead of on lil' Suzy Shortskirts' short skirts. That's as far as it went - guaranteed for someone like Gray. He's just not that kind of man. Parents and their "athletes" have found their Gden Dagger for coaches' backs - accuse them of "verbal abuse!" Absolute rubbish. I'm also loving how every time this happens, some parent worms out the "My son finally quit/was pulled off the team!" Who the hell cares? We've been trying to tell you for some time now: you're not as special as you have been led to believe.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2018 12:19:21 GMT -5
I think most people are missing the point here. I do not know coach Gray or this parent but what I can tell you is we cannot look to past actions and apply them to today's situations. The laws have changed and so have the parent's input and responsibilities. Soft has nothing to do with most of these situations, it is against the law to place your hands on someone out of anger. There is no difference if a teacher grabs a kid and jerks him or her out of the seat out of anger. Why the anger, does it get results, rarely in this day and age. Companies push harassment and tolerance in the work place and the school system should be held to the same standard, my believe is actually higher than the standard, they are educating our kids after all. School should be a safe haven and for a coach or teacher to get angry to a point where they have to act out physically, try that in the work place and see what happens. We talk about teaching kids lessons, how about patience. We talk about teaching kids things that they can take into adulthood, screaming and yelling is the lesson to be taught? You can say what you want but it takes a brave parent to step up like this, after all it is her right to voice her opinion. For the school board to blow her off and act like she is being bothersome, they need to remember who voted them in and the can be voted out. SNOWFLAKE ALERT!!!
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 12:29:59 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by greenman on Jan 10, 2018 12:29:59 GMT -5
I think most people are missing the point here. I do not know coach Gray or this parent but what I can tell you is we cannot look to past actions and apply them to today's situations. The laws have changed and so have the parent's input and responsibilities. Soft has nothing to do with most of these situations, it is against the law to place your hands on someone out of anger. There is no difference if a teacher grabs a kid and jerks him or her out of the seat out of anger. Why the anger, does it get results, rarely in this day and age. Companies push harassment and tolerance in the work place and the school system should be held to the same standard, my believe is actually higher than the standard, they are educating our kids after all. School should be a safe haven and for a coach or teacher to get angry to a point where they have to act out physically, try that in the work place and see what happens. We talk about teaching kids lessons, how about patience. We talk about teaching kids things that they can take into adulthood, screaming and yelling is the lesson to be taught? You can say what you want but it takes a brave parent to step up like this, after all it is her right to voice her opinion. For the school board to blow her off and act like she is being bothersome, they need to remember who voted them in and the can be voted out. SNOWFLAKE ALERT!!! It sounds to me that, once again, the accusing parties have failed to do any homework in regards to the laws in place, haven't documented any specific incidents prior to this, and have either never spoken w/ coach/AD/Admin., or if they HAVE, went in pitching a fit while assuming Johnny's account must be Gospel, and refusing to listen when the other side tried to speak its blarney.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 12:42:14 GMT -5
Post by deathfromabove on Jan 10, 2018 12:42:14 GMT -5
It sounds to me that, once again, the accusing parties have failed to do any homework in regards to the laws in place, haven't documented any specific incidents prior to this, and have either never spoken w/ coach/AD/Admin., or if they HAVE, went in pitching a fit while assuming Johnny's account must be Gospel, and refusing to listen when the other side tried to speak its blarney. They also went to Steve Lindrum (spell check) who has been after Steve Gray for as long as Coach Gray has been here. Maybe he is ****** off cause he wanted the job. I know that I or my wife have never voted for him or will.
|
|
|
Post by utsherman on Jan 10, 2018 12:46:54 GMT -5
Really? The 'Snowflake' rebuttal? <sigh> This is such an astute observation. I'm surprised it wasn't followed with a "back in my day" reference. I get that the point of these forums is for fan conjecture, and the like. But I enjoy the premise that random guy/girl thinks he or she really 'knows' these players and coaches. Of course any family members who may frequent these chats are excluded. I don't pretend to know or peddle crap I hear from some dude who knows the coach, or some other players third uncle. If we could speak in facts, that would be nice. But I'm guessing we don't have all of those, especially on a Sports Talk page. A lot of "sounds to me" or "I'm guessing" or "maybe", etc. on here. I suppose that's to be taken as Gospel. Awesome.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 12:58:29 GMT -5
Post by Willard Dad on Jan 10, 2018 12:58:29 GMT -5
^^^ Nick Saban being a bully to his players?
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 12:59:08 GMT -5
Post by mcm1019 on Jan 10, 2018 12:59:08 GMT -5
Just to clarify: the Board member in question is Steve Linder, he's been ticked off for years and has tried to get Gray run a few times (not to be confused with John Lendrum).
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 13:08:53 GMT -5
Post by deathfromabove on Jan 10, 2018 13:08:53 GMT -5
Really? The 'Snowflake' rebuttal? <sigh> This is such an astute observation. I'm surprised it wasn't followed with a "back in my day" reference. I get that the point of these forums is for fan conjecture, and the like. But I enjoy the premise that random guy/girl thinks he or she really 'knows' these players and coaches. Of course any family members who may frequent these chats are excluded. I don't pretend to know or peddle crap I hear from some dude who knows the coach, or some other players third uncle. If we could speak in facts, that would be nice. But I'm guessing we don't have all of those, especially on a Sports Talk page. A lot of "sounds to me" or "I'm guessing" or "maybe", etc. on here. I suppose that's to be taken as Gospel. Awesome. I do know at least one of these kids and maybe the other, I have to look at my papers to see if I did or not, anyway I know one of them.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 13:11:57 GMT -5
Post by deathfromabove on Jan 10, 2018 13:11:57 GMT -5
Just to clarify: the Board member in question is Steve Linder, he's been ticked off for years and has tried to get Gray run a few times (not to be confused with John Lendrum). Thank You MCM for clarifying that for me. I got mixed up on which one it was.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 13:22:11 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2018 13:22:11 GMT -5
^^^ Nick Saban being a bully to his players? He should be fired immediately.
|
|
|
Post by moneyball on Jan 10, 2018 13:25:58 GMT -5
I think most people are missing the point here. I do not know coach Gray or this parent but what I can tell you is we cannot look to past actions and apply them to today's situations. The laws have changed and so have the parent's input and responsibilities. Soft has nothing to do with most of these situations, it is against the law to place your hands on someone out of anger. There is no difference if a teacher grabs a kid and jerks him or her out of the seat out of anger. Why the anger, does it get results, rarely in this day and age. Companies push harassment and tolerance in the work place and the school system should be held to the same standard, my believe is actually higher than the standard, they are educating our kids after all. School should be a safe haven and for a coach or teacher to get angry to a point where they have to act out physically, try that in the work place and see what happens. We talk about teaching kids lessons, how about patience. We talk about teaching kids things that they can take into adulthood, screaming and yelling is the lesson to be taught? You can say what you want but it takes a brave parent to step up like this, after all it is her right to voice her opinion. For the school board to blow her off and act like she is being bothersome, they need to remember who voted them in and the can be voted out. SNOWFLAKE ALERT!!!Go into work tomorrow and get angry and grab an employee and see what happens. Try it and report back to the forum. Let us know if the human resource department feels it is just cause to get the employee motivated. You can't talk out of both sides of your mouth that it is okay to teach a student a life lesson and it prepare them for the real world and then send them out conditioned to do what you've stated is okay, they will be fired.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 13:39:16 GMT -5
Post by warningtrackpower on Jan 10, 2018 13:39:16 GMT -5
I'm surprised the mouthpiece for Norwalk Athletics that works for the Register, which has covered Norwalk more than some of the other area schools hasn't wrote a piece on the coaching situation in Norwalk. There sure was a quick multi page special for their state title in the Sandusky Register though
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 13:42:48 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2018 13:42:48 GMT -5
Go into work tomorrow and get angry and grab an employee and see what happens. Try it and report back to the forum. Let us know if the human resource department feels it is just cause to get the employee motivated. You can't talk out of both sides of your mouth that it is okay to teach a student a life lesson and it prepare them for the real world and then send them out conditioned to do what you've stated is okay, they will be fired. Try this, you go into work and not do anything correctly that your boss tells you to do. Then the next day only give 50% effort and try to get your coworkers to do the same. Then when your boss raises his voice to you, go to your HR and see how that turns out. You assume this kid was assaulted. Grabbing a jersey and putting someone in position during practice probably happen every week to a player in most of the gyms in Ohio
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 14:40:40 GMT -5
Post by deathfromabove on Jan 10, 2018 14:40:40 GMT -5
How do we know that Scott Hazelwood was there. There was girls basketball games going on that night and he might have been the only one who was available to cover those instead. No matter on how hard I tried I just couldn't be in two places at once. I didn't see who was covering for the reflector but since both papers are own by the same company they go back and forth on who covers what sometime.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 14:48:58 GMT -5
Post by moneyball on Jan 10, 2018 14:48:58 GMT -5
Go into work tomorrow and get angry and grab an employee and see what happens. Try it and report back to the forum. Let us know if the human resource department feels it is just cause to get the employee motivated. You can't talk out of both sides of your mouth that it is okay to teach a student a life lesson and it prepare them for the real world and then send them out conditioned to do what you've stated is okay, they will be fired. Try this, you go into work and not do anything correctly that your boss tells you to do. Then the next day only give 50% effort and try to get your coworkers to do the same. Then when your boss raises his voice to you, go to your HR and see how that turns out. You assume this kid was assaulted. Grabbing a jersey and putting someone in position during practice probably happen every week to a player in most of the gyms in Ohio Putting your hands on someone is not allowed. You can try and slice and dice this however you want. It is not allowed and should not be condoned.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 14:50:32 GMT -5
Post by deathfromabove on Jan 10, 2018 14:50:32 GMT -5
Moneyball, Dude is right on this. There are coaches that do this in pee wee, jr. hi., high school and college around the country than we realize. The only ones who don't touch their players are professional coaches, because they might figure if they did the players might hit back. ROFL
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2018 15:01:23 GMT -5
Try this, you go into work and not do anything correctly that your boss tells you to do. Then the next day only give 50% effort and try to get your coworkers to do the same. Then when your boss raises his voice to you, go to your HR and see how that turns out. You assume this kid was assaulted. Grabbing a jersey and putting someone in position during practice probably happen every week to a player in most of the gyms in Ohio Putting your hands on someone is not allowed. You can try and slice and dice this however you want. It is not allowed and should not be condoned. Again you are looking at an assault and we are slicing and dicing a typical sports practice with no hateful intent. This is not a social event so don't treat it that way. What do you call a wrestling coach sparring with his athlete and throwing him to the mat? That could be considered an assault if you like.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 15:20:32 GMT -5
Post by galion on Jan 10, 2018 15:20:32 GMT -5
Actually, they aren't allowed to do that anymore.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 15:25:45 GMT -5
Post by mrsteel on Jan 10, 2018 15:25:45 GMT -5
Try this, you go into work and not do anything correctly that your boss tells you to do. Then the next day only give 50% effort and try to get your coworkers to do the same. Then when your boss raises his voice to you, go to your HR and see how that turns out. You assume this kid was assaulted. Grabbing a jersey and putting someone in position during practice probably happen every week to a player in most of the gyms in Ohio Putting your hands on someone is not allowed. You can try and slice and dice this however you want. It is not allowed and should not be condoned. Actually the laws are the same. LEARN to know the difference in appropriate and inappropriate touch.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 15:30:37 GMT -5
Post by mrsteel on Jan 10, 2018 15:30:37 GMT -5
Actually, they aren't allowed to do that anymore. Nothing has changed in regard to laws. Appropriate touch is still fine. Even corporal punishment is still allowed, as long as a district has written guidelines.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 15:32:48 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by truckerfan1997 on Jan 10, 2018 15:32:48 GMT -5
Heard from many sources the Oscar kid who is the main kid complaining got kicked off the team for telling a female teacher "yeah I'd f*@k you" and has held a grudge ever since. I'm sure he made that teacher feel great when he demoralized and demeaned her. Should we kick him out of school?
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 16:22:23 GMT -5
Post by galion on Jan 10, 2018 16:22:23 GMT -5
Actually, they aren't allowed to do that anymore. Nothing has changed in regard to laws. Appropriate touch is still fine. Even corporal punishment is still allowed, as long as a district has written guidelines. A coach can demonstrate technique. He CANNOT "spar" with or wrestle a player. Perhaps you missed it earlier this season when Marshawn Lynch went back to his old high school and worked out and practiced with the team. After ESPN showed it the school got into trouble. Adults are no longer allowed to physically compete with the athletes during practice.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 18:16:25 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2018 18:16:25 GMT -5
I want to preface this by saying this is a joke what is happening to Coach Gray. Those of you that are blaming this generation on the entitlement actually have it wrong. All these rules/laws about touching were put into place by people over the age of 50. Not the parents of most high schoolers and definitely not high schoolers themselves. Does it suck? Yes. Where did these problems originate? People born before in the 60’s
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 18:39:22 GMT -5
Post by picabo on Jan 10, 2018 18:39:22 GMT -5
My high school basketball coach wanted me to play more aggressively. She got in my face once during a time-out and yelled at me to "Take that damn skirt off and play basketball!" While I was upset, it also angered me enough to want to show her. I went out and played much more aggressively. Her methods worked. It did not scar me. I did not feel belittled. My father laughed about it after the game and congratulated her for "getting through to me."
My college basketball coached screamed at me after a couple bonehead moves on my part - during the game, in front of my friends, parents, and others. Was I embarrassed? Definitely - but I was embarrassed by screw-ups, not because she screamed at me. After the game, my dad put his arm around me and said, "Rough night out there, huh?" I began to cry, and he basically told me, Don't cry because your coach holds you to a high standard and expects that you can play better than you did; cry when she stops expecting those things from you.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 18:49:23 GMT -5
Post by picabo on Jan 10, 2018 18:49:23 GMT -5
Coaches invest so much of themselves in their teams. It is personal to them. Of course they are going to yell.
And of course players are going to take it personally - they are invested in the game.
Sports are emotional. The adrenaline is already high due to the nature of competition.
What is said in a time-out or in the locker room or screamed out onto the court is not meant to belittle. . . it is meant to get the players' attention - refocus the players.
As parents, we hurt for our children in many situations. We do not want to see our child get yelled at by others. However, we are hurting them when we shield them from life's lessons. Touching a player to move them into position is not abuse. Screaming onto a court or getting into a face or two is not abuse.
We pervert and insult real victims of abuse when we equate these situations with abuse.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 19:32:21 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by moneyball on Jan 10, 2018 19:32:21 GMT -5
Coaches invest so much of themselves in their teams. It is personal to them. Of course they are going to yell. And of course players are going to take it personally - they are invested in the game. Sports are emotional. The adrenaline is already high due to the nature of competition. What is said in a time-out or in the locker room or screamed out onto the court is not meant to belittle. . . it is meant to get the players' attention - refocus the players. As parents, we hurt for our children in many situations. We do not want to see our child get yelled at by others. However, we are hurting them when we shield them from life's lessons. Touching a player to move them into position is not abuse. Screaming onto a court or getting into a face or two is not abuse. We pervert and insult real victims of abuse when we equate these situations with abuse. This isn’t about screaming and getting a players attention, it is about grabbing a player out of anger.
|
|
|
Norwalk
Jan 10, 2018 20:25:42 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by mrsteel on Jan 10, 2018 20:25:42 GMT -5
Everyone saying it's a law, please post this law?
|
|