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Post by tommygunn on Jul 1, 2017 6:49:21 GMT -5
Illegal immigration is costing some states billions! Yup, nothing to see here, just move along.
People coming to work here with a legit visa vs coming illegally and staying are two different things. These farmers are ignoring US law, why should I or any other business jump through the hoops and do everything legit?
Cry me a river NYT. Farmers leaving millions of crops in the fields? Lol. They plant purposely late in the season knowing migrants are heading south to Georgia and then Florida for more work and use this as a huge tax write off because they know when they are planting they will never harvest.
Next time I get pulled over for speeding I am going to tell the cop that I don't believe in speed laws and I will just pass on the ticket, wonder how that will go. Maybe I can speed into a nearby sanctuary speed city and hide out there and protest about how I do not like speed laws.
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Post by clb6110 on Jul 1, 2017 7:17:38 GMT -5
Your ignorance is humorous. You have to be on of the most least knowledgeable posters on this subject that I've read. Oh well somebody has to be the dumbest.
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Post by tommygunn on Jul 1, 2017 9:17:38 GMT -5
I use to have a few rentals around this area and I made the mistake renting to migrants. They tore the house up! Brought a full blown case of roaches with them, and actually were making money off other families they moved in with them. Most of them live as dirty as you can imagine. Had to evict them after complaints from neighbors, and the fact that they broke several items in our contract.
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Post by Rambo McClain on Jul 1, 2017 12:53:20 GMT -5
You ignoring to do something at a business you own is not the same as someone just coming here trying to better their lives and have a job. I still don't understand why people care so much if someone comes here and works a job that no one else is doing anyway. Wrong on all accounts. The NYT article didn't find a single migrant farm worker to interview. All they could find is factory and restaurant workers to interview. People just won't work in factories or restaurants, have to get some illegals to do that. Coming in 2030 - People just won't be family doctors anymore. We have to bring in illegals that charge 1/4th of what an American wants to charge to be a family doctor. Lazy Americans just want too much money to be a family doctor. How dare Americans want to make enough money to live in a decent house. Shouldn't they want to live in a dirty shack with roaches and 15 other people like the illegals. Illegals are needed to be Doctors because Americans want too much money. Health Care is a necessity and American Doctors charge too much.
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Post by Rambo McClain on Jul 1, 2017 13:01:59 GMT -5
Oh and I see people pulling the, 'we have to eat card'. Nobody will go hungry if only legals are hired. I can see you slave lovers crying in 1860 that slaves are necessary because people will go without clothes if workers have to be paid, slaves are needed.
Cotton prices will go up 100,000% if slaves get paid, slavery is necessary so people have clothes. Food prices will go up 100,000% if illegals aren't allowed to do the jobs, illegals are necessary so that people can eat.
Double the price of a field worker and something that costs $1.00 might cost $1.30. Nobody is going hungry. Pay a cotton picker instead of using slaves. Nobody is going without clothes.
Dems loved slaves in 1860 Dems love paying illegals half of what a job should pay in 2017
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Post by Whittaker on Jul 1, 2017 14:48:57 GMT -5
When Rambo types, I hear echoes of the past, strong and sharp.
He is still right.
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Post by buckeyekid on Jul 2, 2017 19:38:13 GMT -5
I read the entire thread ---there's at least 20 comments by posters who think they know what they are talking about and are 100% off base.
For the record,,,Nobody is crying a river about labor. If I ever cry a river, it's because the weather damaged our crops, not because we don't have the people to do the work.
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Post by Rambo McClain on Jul 3, 2017 11:54:54 GMT -5
Taking jobs from illegals. Hidden Cam. You can make some sweet cash being an illegal.
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Post by ScarletFever on Jul 5, 2017 12:03:41 GMT -5
I read the entire thread ---there's at least 20 comments by posters who think they know what they are talking about and are 100% off base Because they're not in your industry or Torch's industry. It's just part of the Trump Tidal Wave, and I say this as someone that voted for him.
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Post by Rambo McClain on Jul 5, 2017 20:02:43 GMT -5
For the record,,,Nobody is crying a river about labor. If I ever cry a river, it's because the weather damaged our crops, not because we don't have the people to do the work. Are you calling the NY Times fake news? They said you guys are watering your fields with tears all because evil Trump scared illegals away with the threat of deportation.
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Post by tommygunn on Jul 6, 2017 17:12:21 GMT -5
Thats why the farms wont comment to the NYT because they know its all bullship what they are printing.
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Post by buckeyekid on Jul 7, 2017 6:39:43 GMT -5
Rambo, I can't speak for other farms in other areas. I can only speak for our farm. We have a substantial labor force and appear to be in decent shape for the summer. If the people don't have the proper ID, they don't get hired simple as that. High majority of the employees we hire are the same ones and the same families that have been here for years. You don't know jack about what we do or who works for us or the cost of labor to produce a crop and the packages there in. You can claim whatever you wish, I'm an owner and I know the facts. We do things the right way, and we work our behinds off doing it right alongside the help from dusk till dawn,,,6 days a week. And yes,,we pay plenty of OT,,it's one of the drawing cards, these people want hours and lots of them---and we provide that.
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Post by Whittaker on Jul 7, 2017 7:19:25 GMT -5
We do things the right way, Good for you and glad to hear it. Would you then agree Buckeye, that the narrative saying that "we need illegals or the crops won't get harvested and prices will skyrocket" is false?
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Post by sportsjock on Jul 7, 2017 7:38:30 GMT -5
Rambo, I can't speak for other farms in other areas. I can only speak for our farm. We have a substantial labor force and appear to be in decent shape for the summer. If the people don't have the proper ID, they don't get hired simple as that. High majority of the employees we hire are the same ones and the same families that have been here for years. You don't jack about what we do or who works for us or the cost of labor to produce a crop and the packages there in. You can claim whatever you wish, I'm an owner and I know the facts. We do things the right way, and we work our jack wagons off doing it right alongside the help from dusk till dawn,,,6 days a week. And yes,,we pay plenty of OT,,it's one the of the drawing cards, these people want hours and lots of them---and we provide that. Very well stated! As you expressed, that has been my experience, having been involved with our family farm most of my life. Most produce farmers don't deserve the negative rap that come in broad stroke generalities. Although we were not produce farmers, we have friends who are and they are all, straight shooting, honest employers, who have gained the trust and loyalties of their workers, developed over many, many years. As you say, the same working families return year after year and in many, if not most, have become like a second family from both ends of the relationship, employees/employer. The old edict certainly applies; you treat your people well, with both respect, dignity and monetarily and you will reap the rewards of dedication and hard work.
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Post by Rambo McClain on Jul 7, 2017 11:15:29 GMT -5
Rambo, I can't speak for other farms in other areas. I can only speak for our farm. We have a substantial labor force and appear to be in decent shape for the summer. If the people don't have the proper ID, they don't get hired simple as that. High majority of the employees we hire are the same ones and the same families that have been here for years. You don't jack about what we do or who works for us or the cost of labor to produce a crop and the packages there in. You can claim whatever you wish, I'm an owner and I know the facts. We do things the right way, and we work our jack wagons off doing it right alongside the help from dusk till dawn,,,6 days a week. And yes,,we pay plenty of OT,,it's one the of the drawing cards, these people want hours and lots of them---and we provide that. If you are doing it the right way then good for you. Most don't, they like their slave labor and pay their workers like slaves. They are the ones that run to the NY Times, CNN and say if we don't let illegals in then food will skyrocket and people will go hungry. You claim to already be paying good wages and are still making a profit. This isn't rocket science. In 1860 they claimed slaves were necessary for cotton picking. In 2017 they claim 'illegals' are necessary for vegetable picking. Nobody went without clothes once the slaves got paid. Nobody will go hungry because only legals pick the vegetables.
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Post by sportsjock on Jul 7, 2017 11:59:29 GMT -5
How do you 'pay your workers like slaves?' Slavery is not paid labor, it's forced labor, with no pay. In 1860 the wide spread logic of cotton plantation owners was that slave labor was a necessary element. Along comes Eli Whitney and his cotton gin, revolutionizing the industry. It made processing cotton and removing the seed a simplified, mechanical process, dramatically lowering the wholesale price of cotton, increasing it's demand and production, thus increasing and expanding the need for more slave labor. Consequently, slavery grew across the south, as a direct result of Eli's new invention and consequent need to plant and harvest more cotton. Long after slavery was outlawed, International Harvester implemented the first practical and dependable cotton picking machine in the 1940's.
I'm not aware of anyone openly advocating 'illegals' for produce picking. Migrants yes, but not illegals. Farmers knowingly employing illegals should be dealt with like any retailer that skirts our labor laws. It is income tax evasion, clear and simple and should be duly charged and prosecuted.
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Post by fanofthegame on Jul 7, 2017 15:01:10 GMT -5
Rambo, I can't speak for other farms in other areas. I can only speak for our farm. We have a substantial labor force and appear to be in decent shape for the summer. If the people don't have the proper ID, they don't get hired simple as that. High majority of the employees we hire are the same ones and the same families that have been here for years. You don't jack about what we do or who works for us or the cost of labor to produce a crop and the packages there in. You can claim whatever you wish, I'm an owner and I know the facts. We do things the right way, and we work our jack wagons off doing it right alongside the help from dusk till dawn,,,6 days a week. And yes,,we pay plenty of OT,,it's one the of the drawing cards, these people want hours and lots of them---and we provide that. If you are doing it the right way then good for you. Most don't, they like their slave labor and pay their workers like slaves. They are the ones that run to the NY Times, CNN and say if we don't let illegals in then food will skyrocket and people will go hungry. You claim to already be paying good wages and are still making a profit. This isn't rocket science. In 1860 they claimed slaves were necessary for cotton picking. In 2017 they claim 'illegals' are necessary for vegetable picking. Nobody went without clothes once the slaves got paid. Nobody will go hungry because only legals pick the vegetables. You used the word "most" in the second sentence. Do you have a reputable source that proves > 50% of farmers use illegal labor?
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Post by tommygunn on Jul 8, 2017 7:14:58 GMT -5
What is a proper ID? A fake one that many illegals can obtain for 50 dollars? Or is it a US issued working VISA that is verified? Anyone can say they check their workers for proper ID, but that is a very grey area that leaves a ton of room for speculation.
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Post by clb6110 on Jul 8, 2017 7:38:36 GMT -5
^^ You might be right I don't know but I can tell you that all the workers in Celeryville have proper documentation,don't get paid in cash and make alot more than slaves.The Dept of Wage and Labor checks records constantly and minimum wage is the least any worker makes and those workers are minimal.The majority make in the teens. I've seen triple that as well for certain crops. Can you say your boss paid you that playing Music? Pun intended.
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Post by sportsjock on Jul 8, 2017 7:38:49 GMT -5
Most all farm working migrants are seasonal, returning to their communities and homes in Mexico and living quite well off the 'slave wages' earned during the harvesting season in the states. These working families have worked the fields for many generations. Why would they bother with fake cards, when legal green cards are available and easily renewed every year?
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Post by fanofthegame on Jul 8, 2017 9:27:24 GMT -5
What is a proper ID? A fake one that many illegals can obtain for 50 dollars? Or is it a US issued working VISA that is verified? Anyone can say they check their workers for proper ID, but that is a very grey area that leaves a ton of room for speculation. Your quote might make your point, but saying something doesn't make it so. If it did I'd be a billionaire.
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Post by ronswanson on Jul 8, 2017 12:17:17 GMT -5
I'm not sure why we are limiting it to just farmers, why are they taking all the heat about possibly hiring illegals? Look around the country at different jobs like construction, landscaping, hotel workers, and look at how many of those workers are Hispanic. How do we know they're all legal? Which brings me back to what I've said in earlier posts on here that I just don't care if these people come to work here. At least they're working which is more that can be said about a lot of Americans.
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Post by tommygunn on Jul 8, 2017 20:30:43 GMT -5
Because ron aka muck farmer, the NYT's played the fiddle for the farmers, which is what this thread is about. Nobody cares about anyone coming here to work. People care about illegals coming here and staying here without becoming a US citizen. I guess you braindead farmers cant figure out the difference.
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Post by Rambo McClain on Jul 8, 2017 20:42:05 GMT -5
At least they're working which is more that can be said about a lot of Americans. Pay more and watch Americans do the job.
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Post by Rambo McClain on Jul 8, 2017 20:43:37 GMT -5
12,000,000 illegals here and not a single person will take ownership of actually employing a single one.
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Post by ronswanson on Jul 8, 2017 22:20:01 GMT -5
I'm no farmer and don't wish to be but I do a lot of driving on the turnpike and see the farms along there and all the hispanics doing the work. I don't care about illegals coming here to work whether it's in farming, construction, wherever it is as long as they're not out murdering people and committing heinous crimes. Other than that, have at it.
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Post by tommygunn on Jul 12, 2017 7:10:43 GMT -5
And many aren't? Illegals are found to murder, rape, bring in drugs, and commit crime daily. Just turn the eye. As long as they are picking your tomatoes.
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Post by bigman on Jul 13, 2017 9:45:05 GMT -5
Illegal vs legal. Law of the land. Sorry some of you can't see it. If I drive without a license and get pulled over and come to find out I have not had a license for 16 years and my excuse is "well, I have to drive to work to support my family". What do you think is going to happen to me? Im going to get a fine and told if I am caught again, I will probably go to jail for some time. The guy in the article has been here for way to long not to pursue citizenship. If he cared about his family so much, that would have been a priority. I agree. He should have started the process a long time ago, but not an apples to apples comparison. You getting a drivers license is one trip to the BMV and $40-50 (whatever the current tax is). His process involves a lot more steps, cost, and a risk of deportation. We'd all like this discussion to be black and white, but the reality is there are shades of gray (like most things in life). I am late to this conversation, but I am a parent and would do whatever I had to do not to be taken away from my kids. Pay money, take classes, whatever it takes I would do it. Like many people he took the "why do this if I am not being made to do it" approach. In the end it is going to cost him his family. The most ironic part of this is that he cannot take his family with him to Mexico because after a year the kids (who are American citizens) will be sent back to the US by the Mexican government.
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Post by DrTorch on Jul 13, 2017 16:29:41 GMT -5
And many aren't? Illegals are found to murder, rape, bring in drugs, and commit crime daily. Just turn the eye. As long as they are picking your tomatoes. hey boss if you want to put a dent in rape build a wall around frat houses just sayin and i'm curious, for the record, how many people have you actually "hired" in your life? you know, from the safety of your stepdad's basement? MMRPGs don't count.
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Post by DrTorch on Jul 13, 2017 16:37:16 GMT -5
when i hire anyone i need (2) forms of ID or a passport, and pass a background check
if a person can do that, and they are illegal, how you gonna blame the employer? we pay HEAVY fines for employing illegals...it's not like you just pull some guy out of the Rio Grande and throw him on your payroll, this isn't 1973
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