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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2020 23:21:05 GMT -5
Who you taking for 2020 season
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Post by dude on Mar 16, 2020 14:07:01 GMT -5
Is there any reason to think that Shelby cannot repeat? They return and 1st and 2nd team player from a roster that was undefeated as well as the Coach of the Year.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2020 22:33:28 GMT -5
Is there any reason to think that Shelby cannot repeat? They return and 1st and 2nd team player from a roster that was undefeated as well as the Coach of the Year. Very true. Ontario returns a nice duo as well along with a very good JV squad.. and RV with a lot experience returning |
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Post by dude on Mar 17, 2020 8:08:19 GMT -5
Is there any reason to think that Shelby cannot repeat? They return and 1st and 2nd team player from a roster that was undefeated as well as the Coach of the Year. Very true. Ontario returns a nice duo as well along with a very good JV squad.. and RV with a lot experience returning Although, we have not mentioned the addition of the powerhouse team that will be added to the MOAC. I'm sure when all the Principals were in discussion of this addition the fear was obvious to all in the room.  |
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Post by galion on Mar 17, 2020 10:11:56 GMT -5
What difference does it make? They'll never be able to play high school sports again for fear of someone catching a cold.
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Post by dude on Mar 17, 2020 11:06:16 GMT -5
Who else in the MOAC is returning a group of starters?
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Mar 17, 2020 14:00:45 GMT -5
Ontario only lost one Senior of worth. They return 4 starters including 1st Team All-District Shaver a 3 year starter and Kurtz at the other guard a 2 year starter. Both averaged double figures each of their 5 years as starters. A fifth starter could be the 6-4 kid that got around 15 minutes a game off the bench. Hopefully they'll get better bench play next year from a 20-2 JV team that lost 2 close road games. They beat Shelby and Harding twice each, as well as Norwalk, Lex, Mansfield Senior, Ashland and Madison.
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Mar 17, 2020 14:19:48 GMT -5
What difference does it make? They'll never be able to play high school sports again for fear of someone catching a cold. I bet you haven't been hugging every stranger that walks down the street. Are you POd because you can't chug down a dozen beers a night at your favorite watering holes?  |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2020 21:20:08 GMT -5
Ontario only lost one Senior of worth. They return 4 starters including 1st Team All-District Shaver a 3 year starter and Kurtz at the other guard a 2 year starter. Both averaged double figures each of their 5 years as starters. A fifth starter could be the 6-4 kid that got around 15 minutes a game off the bench. Hopefully they'll get better bench play next year from a 20-2 JV team that lost 2 close road games. They beat Shelby and Harding twice each, as well as Norwalk, Lex, Mansfield Senior, Ashland and Madison. Hard to believe the shelby vs Ontario game can get much better than the 2nd game at Shelby. But I think we could see two games like that again this season! |
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Post by dude on Mar 23, 2020 10:00:11 GMT -5
Ontario only lost one Senior of worth. They return 4 starters including 1st Team All-District Shaver a 3 year starter and Kurtz at the other guard a 2 year starter. Both averaged double figures each of their 5 years as starters. A fifth starter could be the 6-4 kid that got around 15 minutes a game off the bench. Hopefully they'll get better bench play next year from a 20-2 JV team that lost 2 close road games. They beat Shelby and Harding twice each, as well as Norwalk, Lex, Mansfield Senior, Ashland and Madison. Hard to believe the shelby vs Ontario game can get much better than the 2nd game at Shelby. But I think we could see two games like that again this season! According to post game interviews with the Shelby coach the game at Shelby was only close because the Shelby players did not follow the game plan or play the way there were coached. So the 19 point lead was more about how Shelby played and not the other team. I could see Shelby under the guidance of a young coach only in his 2nd season being even tougher than this past season. And in his 1st season he went undefeated. |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Mar 23, 2020 14:30:20 GMT -5
According to post game interviews with the Ontario coach the game at Shelby was lost because the Ontario players did not follow the game plan or play the way there[sic] were coached. So the evaporation of the 19 point lead was more about how Ontario played not the other team.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2020 16:59:10 GMT -5
According to post game interviews with the Ontario coach the game at Shelby was lost because the Ontario players did not follow the game plan or play the way there[sic] were coached. So the evaporation of the 19 point lead was more about how Ontario played not the other team. Guess their will be agreeing and disagreeing on this subject. Good old fashion tale of two halves. First half shaver couldn’t miss pugh was a non factor second half #12 from Shelby had him on lock and pugh according to his after game interview listened to game plan and took advantage of his size advantage inside and made plays. Regardless Ontario was outright favorite at beginning of the year and no one gave anyone else in the league a chance. |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Mar 23, 2020 20:28:27 GMT -5
With a 19 point lead in the 2nd half Shaver didn't have to score a bunch. What the Ontario coach was talking about was not handling the pressure the way they had practiced. Then when beating the pressure they took bad shots and made bad decisions. Not how they had practiced all year.
A big part of Ontario being the preseason prohibitive favorite was having 6-4 Senior Chance Mott, a letterman as Freshman, back after missing his Junior year with knee surgery. If you were at the fist Shelby/Ontario game you saw him blow out his knee a 2nd time in the 1st quarter. Losing their best inside player took some time to adjust to. How would Shelby have been if they lost Cody Lantz for the year in the 1st quarter of the first Ontario game?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2020 22:05:09 GMT -5
With a 19 point lead in the 2nd half Shaver didn't have to score a bunch. What the Ontario coach was talking about was not handling the pressure the way they had practiced. Then when beating the pressure they took bad shots and made bad decisions. Not how they had practiced all year. A big part of Ontario being the preseason prohibitive favorite was having 6-4 Senior Chance Mott, a letterman as Freshman, back after missing his Junior year with knee surgery. If you were at the fist Shelby/Ontario game you saw him blow out his knee a 2nd time in the 1st quarter. Losing their best inside player took some time to adjust to. How would Shelby have been if they lost Cody Lantz for the year in the 1st quarter of the first Ontario game? Understandable and agree with that. Anticipating a lot from a kid who hadn’t played for a year and a half. Watching a 19pt lead turn into single digits big time players make big time plays. Wasn’t at the first Shelby vs. Ontario game but if I believe so #12 held Shaver to 4pts in the 2nd half. So did he think he didn’t need to score or was he ran tired from trying to do everything!? |
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Post by dude on Mar 24, 2020 10:33:07 GMT -5
With a 19 point lead in the 2nd half Shaver didn't have to score a bunch. What the Ontario coach was talking about was not handling the pressure the way they had practiced. Then when beating the pressure they took bad shots and made bad decisions. Not how they had practiced all year. A big part of Ontario being the preseason prohibitive favorite was having 6-4 Senior Chance Mott, a letterman as Freshman, back after missing his Junior year with knee surgery. If you were at the fist Shelby/Ontario game you saw him blow out his knee a 2nd time in the 1st quarter. Losing their best inside player took some time to adjust to. How would Shelby have been if they lost Cody Lantz for the year in the 1st quarter of the first Ontario game? Understandable and agree with that. Anticipating a lot from a kid who hadn’t played for a year and a half. Watching a 19pt lead turn into single digits big time players make big time plays. Wasn’t at the first Shelby vs. Ontario game but if I believe so #12 held Shaver to 4pts in the 2nd half. So did he think he didn’t need to score or was he ran tired from trying to do everything!? The comparison of Ontario's 3rd or 4th best player to Shelby's 2nd best player is worthless. Saw both games and I have to say giving up a 19 point lead was a shocker for such an experienced team but it does happen. |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Mar 24, 2020 10:50:14 GMT -5
devil,
It was Shelby's helter skelter press in the 2nd half vs a vanilla man defense in the first half that made the difference. In the first half with a slow Pugh defending Shaver he was easily getting his shots where he was comfortable in their half court offense. In the 2nd half with a quick, football player on Shaver and Shelby creating havoc with their press, Shaver wasn't getting shots in his comfort zone. That and turnovers off their press and bad decisions when the press was broken, instead of getting the ball in Shavers hands, he got a lot fewer shots. Also, at that time the light had yet to go off for Shaq Coburn. Down the stretch of the regular season he was averaging more PPG than Shaver. Shaver was used to playing most all the minutes of a game, due to the lack of a decent guard on the bench. Outside of the 6-4 kid and injuies, Ontario had one of the shortest and weakest benches in Balogh's 35 years. The difference between an average team last year and a good team.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2020 16:58:10 GMT -5
Understandable and agree with that. Anticipating a lot from a kid who hadn’t played for a year and a half. Watching a 19pt lead turn into single digits big time players make big time plays. Wasn’t at the first Shelby vs. Ontario game but if I believe so #12 held Shaver to 4pts in the 2nd half. So did he think he didn’t need to score or was he ran tired from trying to do everything!? The comparison of Ontario's 3rd or 4th best player to Shelby's 2nd best player is worthless. Saw both games and I have to say giving up a 19 point lead was a shocker for such an experienced team but it does happen. It does happen. Seen Shelby play on of the best half’s of basketball I’ve seen in a while at Willard. And played a below average second half to go with a young coaching mistake at the end to lose them a large lead. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2020 17:04:56 GMT -5
devil, It was Shelby's helter skelter press in the 2nd half vs a vanilla man defense in the first half that made the difference. In the first half with a slow Pugh defending Shaver he was easily getting his shots where he was comfortable in their half court offense. In the 2nd half with a quick, football player on Shaver and Shelby creating havoc with their press, Shaver wasn't getting shots in his comfort zone. That and turnovers off their press and bad decisions when the press was broken, instead of getting the ball in Shavers hands, he got a lot fewer shots. Also, at that time the light had yet to go off for Shaq Coburn. Down the stretch of the regular season he was averaging more PPG than Shaver. Shaver was used to playing most all the minutes of a game, due to the lack of a decent guard on the bench. Outside of the 6-4 kid and injuies, Ontario had one of the shortest and weakest benches in Balogh's 35 years. The difference between an average team last year and a good team. Agree with all that. I didn’t see Shelby’s Norwalk tournament game in person but watched on WMFD. Seen the clear fork tournament game in person. Anticipate that helter skelter defense to be even better next Season. As hill and two other JV kids played big mins in both games. Looked to be faster defensively and more offensive threats also. But also as a lot of other people still need to see a young coach prove himself in big games. |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Mar 24, 2020 20:30:47 GMT -5
I agree, Shelby at there best this past year against good teams was when they were pressing. Their type of press is difficult to do for an entire game, it can wear on a team using it, as well as the team being pressed. By the 4th quarter negatively affect their offense. Using it with discretion throughout a game, instead of out of desperation, can be more productive. A new coach with the correct athletes will learn how best to use it to his advantage.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 24, 2020 21:25:44 GMT -5
I agree, Shelby at there best this past year against good teams was when they were pressing. Their type of press is difficult to do for an entire game, it can wear on a team using it, as well as the team being pressed. By the 4th quarter negatively affect their offense. Using it with discretion throughout a game, instead of out of desperation, can be more productive. A new coach with the correct athletes will learn how best to use it to his advantage. Having the right personnel played into that for Shelby. As it will this season, I believe Shelby has Some very talented basketball players but definitely a group of good athletes as well. I know from around the community alot of people wasn’t believers in the young coaches philosophy but from the few live games I seen and the handful on WMFD looks to have things headed the right way. |
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Post by dude on Mar 25, 2020 8:55:26 GMT -5
I agree, Shelby at there best this past year against good teams was when they were pressing. Their type of press is difficult to do for an entire game, it can wear on a team using it, as well as the team being pressed. By the 4th quarter negatively affect their offense. Using it with discretion throughout a game, instead of out of desperation, can be more productive. A new coach with the correct athletes will learn how best to use it to his advantage. Having the right personnel played into that for Shelby. As it will this season, I believe Shelby has Some very talented basketball players but definitely a group of good athletes as well. I know from around the community alot of people wasn’t believers in the young coaches philosophy but from the few live games I seen and the handful on WMFD looks to have things headed the right way. Having a 6 foot 5 inch guard who is the best player in the league can help in a lot of ways. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2020 10:58:58 GMT -5
Having the right personnel played into that for Shelby. As it will this season, I believe Shelby has Some very talented basketball players but definitely a group of good athletes as well. I know from around the community alot of people wasn’t believers in the young coaches philosophy but from the few live games I seen and the handful on WMFD looks to have things headed the right way. Having a 6 foot 5 inch guard who is the best player in the league can help in a lot of ways. Arguably best player in district also. But still have to put kids in right positions and teach correct things. Loney had same personnel as previous coach. I don’t know previous coach but only won 12 games from what I was told. |
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Post by dude on Mar 25, 2020 11:29:01 GMT -5
Having a 6 foot 5 inch guard who is the best player in the league can help in a lot of ways. Arguably best player in district also. But still have to put kids in right positions and teach correct things. Loney had same personnel as previous coach. I don’t know previous coach but only won 12 games from what I was told. Saying the best player in the district would be an argument. Previous coach had won had won 184 games at Shelby so Loney is far from that. But if you are comparing Shelby's last season to the recent, DeVito, Gossom and Lantz are all much better now than they were a year ago. All 3 played big minutes last season so it's not a surprise they won 6 less games last season season. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2020 12:38:18 GMT -5
Arguably best player in district also. But still have to put kids in right positions and teach correct things. Loney had same personnel as previous coach. I don’t know previous coach but only won 12 games from what I was told. Saying the best player in the district would be an argument. Previous coach had won had won 184 games at Shelby so Loney is far from that. But if you are comparing Shelby's last season to the recent, DeVito, Gossom and Lantz are all much better now than they were a year ago. All 3 played big minutes last season so it's not a surprise they won 6 less games last season season. Off season builds a program. From what I’ve heard Rice and and Loney spent a lot of hours with those kids. Devito was very limited mins last year. Weightroom and skill work does wonders. We will see what this season brings. |
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Post by dude on Mar 25, 2020 13:24:26 GMT -5
Saying the best player in the district would be an argument. Previous coach had won had won 184 games at Shelby so Loney is far from that. But if you are comparing Shelby's last season to the recent, DeVito, Gossom and Lantz are all much better now than they were a year ago. All 3 played big minutes last season so it's not a surprise they won 6 less games last season season. Off season builds a program. From what I’ve heard Rice and and Loney spent a lot of hours with those kids. Devito was very limited mins last year. Weightroom and skill work does wonders. We will see what this season brings. No offense to anyone but in the handful of games that I saw it was not skill that was the difference. It was the hustle, chaos and relentless defense that was the difference. If Shelby wasn't scoring from layups or offensive rebounding they struggled. Most of the teams have coaches that spend countless hours with their players, so it's good you recognize that. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2020 13:50:23 GMT -5
Off season builds a program. From what I’ve heard Rice and and Loney spent a lot of hours with those kids. Devito was very limited mins last year. Weightroom and skill work does wonders. We will see what this season brings. No offense to anyone but in the handful of games that I saw it was not skill that was the difference. It was the hustle, chaos and relentless defense that was the difference. If Shelby wasn't scoring from layups or offensive rebounding they struggled. Most of the teams have coaches that spend countless hours with their players, so it's good you recognize that. That “relentless” defense doesn’t become born over night I don’t think. From the games I seen last year at Shelby that wasn’t the style of defense ran. So at some point and time that defensive skill was acquired. Don’t think you learn that at AAU at least from the many tournaments I’ve been at the past summers |
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Post by fanofthegame on Mar 25, 2020 16:28:00 GMT -5
Agreed that some younger kids developed, but a couple of good ones also graduated. Talent is comparable between the last two years.
Schwemley played a pretty intense defense, too. IMO the difference was how deep into the bench each year went. Schwemley played 7, maybe 8. The new coach played 9-10 depending on the night.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2020 18:35:02 GMT -5
Agreed that some younger kids developed, but a couple of good ones also graduated. Talent is comparable between the last two years. Schwemley played a pretty intense defense, too. IMO the difference was how deep into the bench each year went. Schwemley played 7, maybe 8. The new coach played 9-10 depending on the night. Agree with that! Some Nights I 10-11.. definitely need to play that many with that style of defense. And be in very good basketball shape. |
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Post by dude on Mar 26, 2020 8:13:34 GMT -5
Agreed that some younger kids developed, but a couple of good ones also graduated. Talent is comparable between the last two years. Schwemley played a pretty intense defense, too. IMO the difference was how deep into the bench each year went. Schwemley played 7, maybe 8. The new coach played 9-10 depending on the night. Agree with that! Some Nights I 10-11.. definitely need to play that many with that style of defense. And be in very good basketball shape. Going 10-11 deep in a game that's close is one thing. Doing it when the lead is 15 or more is something else. How many guys played in all 22 games? Regardless of last season, Shelby should be the heavy favorite in the MOAC for 2020-2021. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2020 8:43:34 GMT -5
Agree with that! Some Nights I 10-11.. definitely need to play that many with that style of defense. And be in very good basketball shape. Going 10-11 deep in a game that's close is one thing. Doing it when the lead is 15 or more is something else. How many guys played in all 22 games? Regardless of last season, Shelby should be the heavy favorite in the MOAC for 2020-2021. I didn’t see many games. Seen 5 in person. Every game I seen their was 10 played. Upper Sandusky, Ontario, Harding, Senior, and Clear fork tournament game. Which 11 had played before halftime. Does anyone think RV Going to be the sleeper. Returning all starters! A lot of talent |
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