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Post by jjmcomb on Jan 8, 2017 11:34:07 GMT -5
I wasn't comparing the players. That would be an apples to oranges comparison. I was simply saying that the same school was able to change their basketball schedule in less than a year's notice.
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bigox
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Post by bigox on Jan 8, 2017 19:31:14 GMT -5
OK here is my opinion on these things...
1. Everyone is on the whole big bad Upper kick because they are on a great run. Upper is on the bottom side of enrollment for d2. Yeah they are bigger get over it. Many years they were at the bottom of the enrollment size in the Nol and they survived. 2. The administration and coaches are not perfect nor mind readers. They scheduled teams that were former rivals stave one. 3. ALL of the NOL OCC SBC and MOAC division two size schools would lose to the top half of the WBC. Case in point Wooster barely beat Elida this weekend by two points and Elida is picked to be a middle of the pack team in that league. So before you all jump on the Upper is soft band wagon ponder that.
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Hagen
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Post by Hagen on Jan 8, 2017 22:18:46 GMT -5
Actually Upper has some nice young players. The problem isn't the strength of their non-league schedule. The problem is playing 16 games in a bad conference I'm sure they do. Winslow runs a very good program. CC's "nice young players" are seeing significant varsity minutes and winning most of their games.N10 is a bad conference for a DII team to be in. Their choice. Not so much for a DIV or even a DIII. CC's young players are playing because they have to. I'm sure Sheldon would prefer a stronger group of juniors/seniors. Fact is that enormous effort has been put into making this freshman class great. Imagine if this type of effort was put into all classes. If this class doesn't win 1-2 league titles, then it will have been a disappointment for as much build up as its received. N10 is a bad conference for any quality team to be in this year. CC & Carey's teams are good, but presently don't compare to their own teams of recent years and BC & Wynford are down. Just not a good year of talent across the board.
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Post by royalballdad on Jan 9, 2017 8:48:40 GMT -5
CC's freshman are playing because they are skilled basketball players with experience playing the game at higher levels via their summer travel teams. They are much more skilled with higher basketball IQ's then the players in the classes above them. Nothing to do with FAVORITISM or extra EFFORT by coaches. CC's freshman are also more committed to the basketball program and put EFFORT in on their own in the off-season. That is why they are playing. The coaches at CC (like all schools) have put EFFORT into "all classes". The players in those other classes CHOSE to do other things instead working on their own and participating in team basketball opportunities in the off-season therefore they were passed up by the younger players. Very simple!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2017 8:57:22 GMT -5
A polite way of saying the upper classes are not very good.
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Hagen
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Post by Hagen on Jan 9, 2017 9:03:55 GMT -5
A polite way of saying the upper classes are not very good. Agreed. I never said they weren't better than the upperclassmen or more dedicated. I said I believe that Sheldon would prefer to have a stronger group of juniors/seniors ahead of them so all the freshmen weren't playing so many varsity minutes at this point. A senior body is more mature than a freshman, and against the better teams, that makes a difference if talent is similar. However in today's game, gone are the days of having classes of 7-10 kids in every senior class of basketball. CC doesn't have a strong group of upperclassmen, which in turn, allows these freshmen to play the minutes they are.
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Hagen
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Post by Hagen on Jan 9, 2017 9:39:17 GMT -5
CC's freshman are playing because they are skilled basketball players with experience playing the game at higher levels via their summer travel teams. They are much more skilled with higher basketball IQ's then the players in the classes above them. Nothing to do with FAVORITISM or extra EFFORT by coaches. CC's freshman are also more committed to the basketball program and put EFFORT in on their own in the off-season. That is why they are playing. The coaches at CC (like all schools) have put EFFORT into "all classes". The players in those other classes CHOSE to do other things instead working on their own and participating in team basketball opportunities in the off-season therefore they were passed up by the younger players. Very simple! I will say that this is not true. All coaches do not put forth the same amount of effort, much less into all classes, for various reasons. Good and bad programs keeping the course is an example of this. All coaches are not the same. I will say Sheldon puts forth solid effort as a whole and his program reflects that. However, to say other coaches put forth similar effort just isn't true. Honestly, if Sheldon didn't give more effort into this class, then he'd be dumb as they do have high potential. All players and coaches are not created equal.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2017 12:03:44 GMT -5
A polite way of saying the upper classes are not very good. Agreed. I never said they weren't better than the upperclassmen or more dedicated. I said I believe that Sheldon would prefer to have a stronger group of juniors/seniors ahead of them so all the freshmen weren't playing so many varsity minutes at this point. A senior body is more mature than a freshman, and against the better teams, that makes a difference if talent is similar. However in today's game, gone are the days of having classes of 7-10 kids in every senior class of basketball. CC doesn't have a strong group of upperclassmen, which in turn, allows these freshmen to play the minutes they are. Northmor may have been an example of that.
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Post by royalballdad on Jan 9, 2017 13:44:14 GMT -5
Was at the Nprthmor vs CC game as Wynford did not play. Poor shooting cost CC in the Northmor game - period! Not anything to do with "senior bodies". CC's freshman pg was leading scorer for the game and scored 1/2 his points at the rim and was the most aggressive & physical player on the floor. The other 2 freshman only saw limited minutes. The 3 Juniors and 1 senior played most of the game and all four of those players are "senior body" type players. CC matched up to Northmor's physical size... they just did not shoot it well other than their pg and he did not shoot well in the 1st half. Just my opinion after observing the game in person.
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Jan 9, 2017 14:30:13 GMT -5
OK here is my opinion on these things... 1. Everyone is on the whole big bad Upper kick because they are on a great run. Upper is on the bottom side of enrollment for d2. Yeah they are bigger get over it. Many years they were at the bottom of the enrollment size in the Nol and they survived. 2. The administration and coaches are not perfect nor mind readers. They scheduled teams that were former rivals stave one. 3. ALL of the NOL OCC SBC and MOAC division two size schools would lose to the top half of the WBC. Case in point Wooster barely beat Elida this weekend by two points and Elida is picked to be a middle of the pack team in that league. So before you all jump on the Upper is soft band wagon ponder that. Did all of the Wooster players play against Elida? Due to several being in the stands at Lexington where the fight broke out.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2017 14:33:56 GMT -5
OK here is my opinion on these things... 1. Everyone is on the whole big bad Upper kick because they are on a great run. Upper is on the bottom side of enrollment for d2. Yeah they are bigger get over it. Many years they were at the bottom of the enrollment size in the Nol and they survived. 2. The administration and coaches are not perfect nor mind readers. They scheduled teams that were former rivals stave one. 3. ALL of the NOL OCC SBC and MOAC division two size schools would lose to the top half of the WBC. Case in point Wooster barely beat Elida this weekend by two points and Elida is picked to be a middle of the pack team in that league. So before you all jump on the Upper is soft band wagon ponder that. Currently Elida is tied for 1st in the WBL
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Jan 9, 2017 14:35:04 GMT -5
I'm sure they do. Winslow runs a very good program. CC's "nice young players" are seeing significant varsity minutes and winning most of their games.N10 is a bad conference for a DII team to be in. Their choice. Not so much for a DIV or even a DIII. CC's young players are playing because they have to. I'm sure Sheldon would prefer a stronger group of juniors/seniors. Fact is that enormous effort has been put into making this freshman class great. Imagine if this type of effort was put into all classes. If this class doesn't win 1-2 league titles, then it will have been a disappointment for as much build up as its received. N10 is a bad conference for any quality team to be in this year. CC & Carey's teams are good, but presently don't compare to their own teams of recent years and BC & Wynford are down. Just not a good year of talent across the board. This class had several kids play at a relatively high level in AAU ball. The same "effort" can not be made with every class if similar talent isn't there. The REAL "effort" came from the parents who spent the time and money to make the "effort". By OHSAA Bylaws it's not allowed for high school or Jr High coaches to facilitate or help in this "effort".
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2017 14:36:14 GMT -5
OK here is my opinion on these things... 1. Everyone is on the whole big bad Upper kick because they are on a great run. Upper is on the bottom side of enrollment for d2. Yeah they are bigger get over it. Many years they were at the bottom of the enrollment size in the Nol and they survived. 2. The administration and coaches are not perfect nor mind readers. They scheduled teams that were former rivals stave one. 3. ALL of the NOL OCC SBC and MOAC division two size schools would lose to the top half of the WBC. Case in point Wooster barely beat Elida this weekend by two points and Elida is picked to be a middle of the pack team in that league. So before you all jump on the Upper is soft band wagon ponder that. Currently Elida is tied for 1st in the WBL Haha yes you're correct, but they have played 2 league games
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2017 14:48:29 GMT -5
They only play 9 total so a lead at any point is pretty big.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2017 14:54:24 GMT -5
They only play 9 total so a lead at any point is pretty big. They are tied with 2 teams and one game up on 4. I doubt they are too excited, but that's better than being 0-2
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bigox
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Post by bigox on Jan 9, 2017 15:24:19 GMT -5
OK here is my opinion on these things... 1. Everyone is on the whole big bad Upper kick because they are on a great run. Upper is on the bottom side of enrollment for d2. Yeah they are bigger get over it. Many years they were at the bottom of the enrollment size in the Nol and they survived. 2. The administration and coaches are not perfect nor mind readers. They scheduled teams that were former rivals stave one. 3. ALL of the NOL OCC SBC and MOAC division two size schools would lose to the top half of the WBC. Case in point Wooster barely beat Elida this weekend by two points and Elida is picked to be a middle of the pack team in that league. So before you all jump on the Upper is soft band wagon ponder that. Did all of the Wooster players play against Elida? Due to several being in the stands at Lexington where the fight broke out. No clue. Just know that the level of talent in that league on a whole far surpasses the level of play in each of the above mentioned leagues. Want to fact check it go watch the hudle app for a couple of games. Much more physical and better talent in the games I have watched.
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bigox
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Post by bigox on Jan 9, 2017 15:36:41 GMT -5
OK here is my opinion on these things... 1. Everyone is on the whole big bad Upper kick because they are on a great run. Upper is on the bottom side of enrollment for d2. Yeah they are bigger get over it. Many years they were at the bottom of the enrollment size in the Nol and they survived. 2. The administration and coaches are not perfect nor mind readers. They scheduled teams that were former rivals stave one. 3. ALL of the NOL OCC SBC and MOAC division two size schools would lose to the top half of the WBC. Case in point Wooster barely beat Elida this weekend by two points and Elida is picked to be a middle of the pack team in that league. So before you all jump on the Upper is soft band wagon ponder that. Currently Elida is tied for 1st in the WBL 5-4 overall and played two of the team picked preseason below them so not much stock in tied for first place lol!
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Post by fbfan on Jan 9, 2017 16:40:12 GMT -5
Was at the Nprthmor vs CC game as Wynford did not play. Poor shooting cost CC in the Northmor game - period! Not anything to do with "senior bodies". CC's freshman pg was leading scorer for the game and scored 1/2 his points at the rim and was the most aggressive & physical player on the floor. The other 2 freshman only saw limited minutes. The 3 Juniors and 1 senior played most of the game and all four of those players are "senior body" type players. CC matched up to Northmor's physical size... they just did not shoot it well other than their pg and he did not shoot well in the 1st half. Just my opinion after observing the game in person. Agee with this.^^ Can't wait till the 5-11, 6-2, 6-3, and 6-5 freshman bodies mature into "senior bodies".
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Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2017 22:13:27 GMT -5
Currently Elida is tied for 1st in the WBL 5-4 overall and played two of the team picked preseason below them so not much stock in tied for first place lol! Actually they are 3-1 against WBL teams.
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bigox
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Post by bigox on Jan 10, 2017 6:54:18 GMT -5
5-4 overall and played two of the team picked preseason below them so not much stock in tied for first place lol! Actually they are 3-1 against WBL teams. Again they beat a team picked below them preseason. They have yet to play OG Wapakoneta van wert and will lose to Shawnee again putting them right where they were picked. But regardless any team but Celina from there would be league contenders in any conference this direction if not Champs.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2017 9:02:14 GMT -5
Haha. You say they are middle of the pack but you keep listing teams picked to finish below them.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2017 9:06:57 GMT -5
Don't worry about the "WBC" (WBL), Upper is ranked #1 in the state.
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bigox
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Post by bigox on Jan 10, 2017 9:09:16 GMT -5
5-4 overall and played two of the team picked preseason below them so not much stock in tied for first place lol! Actually they are 3-1 against WBL teams. Again they beat a team picked below them preseason. They have yet to play OG Wapakoneta van wert and will lose to Shawnee again putting them right where they were picked. But regardless any team but Celina from there would be league contenders in any conference this direction if not Champs.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2017 10:17:32 GMT -5
You mean the Van Wert team that lost to 4-6 Lincolnview? And the Wapakoneta team that lost to 5-3 Minster? Point being, teams can rise up for certain opponents. Maybe Elida played very well, or Wooster(short handed) did not play well.
I'm a little confused. Are you pointing out how strong the WBL is or how weak the schedule of Upper Sandusky is? I don't think anyone has ever said the WBL was not a strong league. I enjoy discussing difference of opinion on teams leagues and schedules. Always fun to see how things end up. But as many teams find out, playing a single team once and playing well is much different then preparing for a league every week. I will say IMO, after seeing some games, Wooster would win the WBL. Lexington, Ashland and Madison could contend for the WBL title or at least be a factor. Sandusky could be a contender for the WBL title. Vermilion could be a contender for the WBL title. IMO, only the MOAC, mainly small rural schools, could be won by a multitude of WBL teams.
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bigox
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Post by bigox on Jan 10, 2017 10:49:00 GMT -5
Haha. You say they are middle of the pack but you keep listing teams picked to finish below them. The teams I listed are all picked to finish above Elida in the preseason poll put out by 93.1 The Fan and Lima News.
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bigox
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Post by bigox on Jan 10, 2017 11:03:51 GMT -5
My point being is that the schools in that league 1-8 in my opinion as I stated would be better than the teams in the NOL for sure. OCC definitely. SBC positively. And MOAC by far. Wooster and maybe Vermillion could hang with that league consistently. Lexington would be at the same level as Van wert or Elida. I feel Upper would be in the same boat as Lexington or Sandusky IF they had to playe similar schedules that those teams play in that league. But just my opinion from what I have seen over the years. And this season so far.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2017 12:24:48 GMT -5
Haha. You say they are middle of the pack but you keep listing teams picked to finish below them. The teams I listed are all picked to finish above Elida in the preseason poll put out by 93.1 The Fan and Lima News. I was referring to the teams they are currently ahead of.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2017 12:34:18 GMT -5
My point being is that the schools in that league 1-8 in my opinion as I stated would be better than the teams in the NOL for sure. OCC definitely. SBC positively. And MOAC by far. Wooster and maybe Vermillion could hang with that league consistently. Lexington would be at the same level as Van wert or Elida. I feel Upper would be in the same boat as Lexington or Sandusky IF they had to playe similar schedules that those teams play in that league. But just my opinion from what I have seen over the years. And this season so far. Are you saying van Wert and Elida are not in the top 8 of the WBL? van Wert just lost to Ottawa Glandorf by 4 in OT. The thing to remember is they play each other once for the WBL title. So the question is when looking at their records, is their non-conference very strong. Most play schools much smaller and have losses to those schools, as I provided. I think basketball in that area is good but I do not think any team 1-8 of the WBL could win the NOL, OCC, SBC or the MOAC. could the best school? Yes probably, but I feel the best team from the NOL could compete for a WBL title. And the best teams in the SBC and OCC could win the WBL. Only time will tell.
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Jan 10, 2017 21:04:36 GMT -5
Two or three teamS in the SBC are better than Sandusky THIS year? Last year? The SBC does get bigger and stronger next year when 6 NOL teams combine with the SBC.
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Post by defense101 on Jan 10, 2017 21:06:06 GMT -5
Just watched Wapakoneta (D2) play Bluffton which last time I checked Bluffton was borderline D3 almost D4. As I was looking at all the schedules of the WBL teams majority of there non-conference games are smaller schools.
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