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Post by ScarletFever on Jul 18, 2017 22:39:01 GMT -5
I'm hearing our fairly new football coach is being allowed to teach at or near Ohio Northern this year?
Very confusing, and I would highly doubt he will be back to Willard if this is the case as he will find a different job in western Ohio.
How are you supposed to keep an eye on your football kids during the day? How are you supposed to talk to them during the day and build camaraderie?
Task force kicking butt yet again
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Post by galion on Jul 19, 2017 3:19:17 GMT -5
Hawkins taught in Willard the entire time he was the head coach here. What's the big deal? Did this guy ever teach in Willard to begin with? In addition,camaraderie is not built in the hallway of the school it is built during the off season workouts and two a days.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2017 8:04:48 GMT -5
I'm hearing our fairly new football coach is being allowed to teach at or near Ohio Northern this year? Very confusing, and I would highly doubt he will be back to Willard if this is the case as he will find a different job in western Ohio. How are you supposed to keep an eye on your football kids during the day? How are you supposed to talk to them during the day and build camaraderie? Task force kicking butt yet again "being allowed to"? What is that all about? It's a supplemental contract not a document of ownership. |
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Post by greenman on Jul 19, 2017 8:12:01 GMT -5
I'm hearing our fairly new football coach is being allowed to teach at or near Ohio Northern this year? Very confusing, and I would highly doubt he will be back to Willard if this is the case as he will find a different job in western Ohio. How are you supposed to keep an eye on your football kids during the day? How are you supposed to talk to them during the day and build camaraderie? Task force kicking butt yet again Has it ever occurred to you that Willard had no full time positions available, and that in the times we live in now, schools like Willard can't just fabricate a phony position just to keep a coach in-house all day? Maybe Willard did have something to offer, but it didn't fit his teaching credentials or desires. Maybe Willard made an offer that wasn't as good financially as what he's got going on now. Perhaps he wants to take his developing a relationship with the community slower than some other coaches in other districts, dipping his toes in the water until he feels the job will be reasonably stable for a football coach. If he's not teaching there, it's pretty much on the district to find him a position, not the other way around, Also, as to the notion that coaches are extra-responsible for their players during the school-day: I've always felt that was unfair, unless the coach is also officially the Dean of Discipline. A school faculty has a shared responsibility, and as far as keeping tabs on player behavior during the day goes, there's this thing called "e-mail." No reason he can't have contact with Willard teachers to keep tabs on kids. People have to realize that teachers, and coaches, are human beings, too. We have our own professional aspirations, and believe it or not, our own personal aspirations and desires that are separate from being at the beck and call of students and their parents. It's not against the law to teach in one district and work in another so long as you can meet the contractual obligations of both positions. We are, believe it or not, grown, thinking adults ourselves, and the Willard coach, at the moment, is answerable to Willard only in the context of what he can do for the football program. You don't get to run his personal or full-time professional life. |
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Post by fanofthegame on Jul 19, 2017 11:57:38 GMT -5
I'm guessing Scarlet is not happy with Willard BOE not the coach. I suspect he expected them to make him an offer to get him in the district.
You have to admit having the coach walking the hallways is going to build rapport and trust. Seeing him at practice only is going to slow that process.
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Post by concernedcitizen on Jul 19, 2017 13:09:09 GMT -5
Any information on this unconcernedcitizen?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2017 14:58:48 GMT -5
Walking the halls can be over rated. Trust between players and coaches is built in during practice, games and off season conditioning events.
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Post by fanofthegame on Jul 19, 2017 15:12:46 GMT -5
Walking the halls can be over rated. Trust between players and coaches is built in during practice, games and off season conditioning events. Sure, and hanging out in his room during your study hall. I'm not going to buy that it's not an advantage. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2017 16:12:16 GMT -5
I'm hearing our fairly new football coach is being allowed to teach at or near Ohio Northern this year? Very confusing, and I would highly doubt he will be back to Willard if this is the case as he will find a different job in western Ohio. How are you supposed to keep an eye on your football kids during the day? How are you supposed to talk to them during the day and build camaraderie? Task force kicking butt yet again Has it ever occurred to you that Willard had no full time positions available, and that in the times we live in now, schools like Willard can't just fabricate a phony position just to keep a coach in-house all day? Maybe Willard did have something to offer, but it didn't fit his teaching credentials or desires. Maybe Willard made an offer that wasn't as good financially as what he's got going on now. Perhaps he wants to take his developing a relationship with the community slower than some other coaches in other districts, dipping his toes in the water until he feels the job will be reasonably stable for a football coach. If he's not teaching there, it's pretty much on the district to find him a position, not the other way around, Also, as to the notion that coaches are extra-responsible for their players during the school-day: I've always felt that was unfair, unless the coach is also officially the Dean of Discipline. A school faculty has a shared responsibility, and as far as keeping tabs on player behavior during the day goes, there's this thing called "e-mail." No reason he can't have contact with Willard teachers to keep tabs on kids. People have to realize that teachers, and coaches, are human beings, too. We have our own professional aspirations, and believe it or not, our own personal aspirations and desires that are separate from being at the beck and call of students and their parents. It's not against the law to teach in one district and work in another so long as you can meet the contractual obligations of both positions. We are, believe it or not, grown, thinking adults ourselves, and the Willard coach, at the moment, is answerable to Willard only in the context of what he can do for the football program. You don't get to run his personal or full-time professional life. They created a position for new basketball coach |
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Post by ScarletFever on Jul 19, 2017 16:47:12 GMT -5
Good points by both sides, honestly no big dog in the fight as I get older I'm not as wrapped up in this anymore.
However I know several ppl in Willard felt the points in my above post so wanted to put on here for discussion.
I'm tired of talking about the Indians until they get off their ***.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2017 21:37:15 GMT -5
Walking the halls can be over rated. Trust between players and coaches is built in during practice, games and off season conditioning events. Sure, and hanging out in his room during your study hall. I'm not going to buy that it's not an advantage. Maybe, but when you look at all the good coaches who teach in junior high or elementary buildings, or teach in another district. Some coaches don't even teach so just because he is not walking the halls does not guarantee anything from what I've seen. |
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Post by unconcernedcitizen on Jul 20, 2017 7:21:18 GMT -5
Any information on this unconcernedcitizen? Scarlet, you are telling me that you would not take a visiting professor job at a university as a better opportunity for maybe down the road? Also bill inselman at Patrick Henry has one of the most successful programs around the area and has never in 28 years taught a day in that school! But tell me again that coaches are required to be in the building! 5 coaches on willards staff are in the building every single day! It isn't about jsut the head coach being there! |
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Post by greenman on Jul 20, 2017 10:26:52 GMT -5
Walking the halls can be over rated. Trust between players and coaches is built in during practice, games and off season conditioning events. Sure, and hanging out in his room during your study hall. I'm not going to buy that it's not an advantage. Hanging out in his room during study hall is generally not where the guys are really supposed to be, in my experience. They usually don't get much studying done there, and if they don't have a need for a study hall, the boys should really fill their schedule with something productive instead. |
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Post by greenman on Jul 20, 2017 10:33:47 GMT -5
Has it ever occurred to you that Willard had no full time positions available, and that in the times we live in now, schools like Willard can't just fabricate a phony position just to keep a coach in-house all day? Maybe Willard did have something to offer, but it didn't fit his teaching credentials or desires. Maybe Willard made an offer that wasn't as good financially as what he's got going on now. Perhaps he wants to take his developing a relationship with the community slower than some other coaches in other districts, dipping his toes in the water until he feels the job will be reasonably stable for a football coach. If he's not teaching there, it's pretty much on the district to find him a position, not the other way around, Also, as to the notion that coaches are extra-responsible for their players during the school-day: I've always felt that was unfair, unless the coach is also officially the Dean of Discipline. A school faculty has a shared responsibility, and as far as keeping tabs on player behavior during the day goes, there's this thing called "e-mail." No reason he can't have contact with Willard teachers to keep tabs on kids. People have to realize that teachers, and coaches, are human beings, too. We have our own professional aspirations, and believe it or not, our own personal aspirations and desires that are separate from being at the beck and call of students and their parents. It's not against the law to teach in one district and work in another so long as you can meet the contractual obligations of both positions. We are, believe it or not, grown, thinking adults ourselves, and the Willard coach, at the moment, is answerable to Willard only in the context of what he can do for the football program. You don't get to run his personal or full-time professional life. They created a position for new basketball coach Was there a sufficient student demand for whatever he is/was teaching? If not, that's skirting the line of fraud, and is certainly a waste. If positions like that are created with phony-baloney courses, the BOE would be better served surveying the community what they'd like to see added to the genuine academic opportunities, i.e., opening up a new language in the Foreign Lang. dept., business electives, AP courses, etc. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2017 12:03:26 GMT -5
Has it ever occurred to you that Willard had no full time positions available, and that in the times we live in now, schools like Willard can't just fabricate a phony position just to keep a coach in-house all day? Maybe Willard did have something to offer, but it didn't fit his teaching credentials or desires. Maybe Willard made an offer that wasn't as good financially as what he's got going on now. Perhaps he wants to take his developing a relationship with the community slower than some other coaches in other districts, dipping his toes in the water until he feels the job will be reasonably stable for a football coach. If he's not teaching there, it's pretty much on the district to find him a position, not the other way around, Also, as to the notion that coaches are extra-responsible for their players during the school-day: I've always felt that was unfair, unless the coach is also officially the Dean of Discipline. A school faculty has a shared responsibility, and as far as keeping tabs on player behavior during the day goes, there's this thing called "e-mail." No reason he can't have contact with Willard teachers to keep tabs on kids. People have to realize that teachers, and coaches, are human beings, too. We have our own professional aspirations, and believe it or not, our own personal aspirations and desires that are separate from being at the beck and call of students and their parents. It's not against the law to teach in one district and work in another so long as you can meet the contractual obligations of both positions. We are, believe it or not, grown, thinking adults ourselves, and the Willard coach, at the moment, is answerable to Willard only in the context of what he can do for the football program. You don't get to run his personal or full-time professional life. They created a position for new basketball coach Maybe the basketball players go and hang out in a 6th grade class during their study hall. |
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Post by fanofthegame on Jul 20, 2017 12:16:10 GMT -5
Sure, and hanging out in his room during your study hall. I'm not going to buy that it's not an advantage. Hanging out in his room during study hall is generally not where the guys are really supposed to be, in my experience. They usually don't get much studying done there, and if they don't have a need for a study hall, the boys should really fill their schedule with something productive instead. Don't be so literal. You get my point. The more interaction a coach has with the kids the stronger the relationship and the faster it develops. Of course there are great coaches that aren't in the building. Nobody can deny that more opportunities exist when the guy is in the building and the more opportunities the better. Not just study hall. Lunch, the hallway, the parking lot. The coach can wander into study hall, gym class, etc on his planning period. Also, I'll give a football a player a study hall even if they don't always need it. If they get good grades and are in college prep classes and doing well you don't think they could use an occasional 45 minutes to chill. They have a part time job after school. It's called football. They're kids. They have plenty of time to work their butts off when they're our age. One study hall isn't going to kill their Ivy League chances. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2017 13:09:55 GMT -5
Hanging out in his room during study hall is generally not where the guys are really supposed to be, in my experience. They usually don't get much studying done there, and if they don't have a need for a study hall, the boys should really fill their schedule with something productive instead. Don't be so literal. You get my point. The more interaction a coach has with the kids the stronger the relationship and the faster it develops. Of course there are great coaches that aren't in the building. Nobody can deny that more opportunities exist when the guy is in the building and the more opportunities the better. Not just study hall. Lunch, the hallway, the parking lot. The coach can wander into study hall, gym class, etc on his planning period. That was the model for head coaches 40 years ago but somewhere about 15-20 years ago things started to change. Kids started to change. Parenting started to change. Kids have more to do, are more independent(in some ways) and are asked to grow up in a different world. With my kids I actually saw benefits of coaches not being the kid's building, limiting contact and teaching the kids that EVERYONE is monitoring them and could wander in at any time. Getting a little off topic but I think we all see this from both sides. |
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Post by fanofthegame on Jul 20, 2017 16:56:30 GMT -5
Agree to disagree. If you want to minimize the time your coach is exposed to your kids then he shouldn't be the guy, IMO. Give me an specific example where less contact is better. Change my mind.
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Post by galion on Jul 20, 2017 17:32:32 GMT -5
Well the example of Patrick Henry was just brought up a few posts ago and I brought up Hawkins at Galion at the beginning of the thread. Those are 2 specific examples.
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Post by fanofthegame on Jul 20, 2017 17:44:10 GMT -5
Well the example of Patrick Henry was just brought up a few posts ago and I brought up Hawkins at Galion at the beginning of the thread. Those are 2 specific examples. I didn't say an example where it worked. I'm asking for an example where it's better. I agree it can work. I find it hard to believe it's better. |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Jul 20, 2017 18:28:15 GMT -5
Joe Balogh has told me many times that being in school every day is a big part of being a head coach.
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Jul 20, 2017 18:32:46 GMT -5
Well the example of Patrick Henry was just brought up a few posts ago and I brought up Hawkins at Galion at the beginning of the thread. Those are 2 specific examples. Didn't Hawkin's say it was hard to tell his players that they should be at practice on time every day when he couldn't always be there on time? |
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Post by greenman on Jul 20, 2017 20:44:00 GMT -5
Hanging out in his room during study hall is generally not where the guys are really supposed to be, in my experience. They usually don't get much studying done there, and if they don't have a need for a study hall, the boys should really fill their schedule with something productive instead. Don't be so literal. You get my point. The more interaction a coach has with the kids the stronger the relationship and the faster it develops. Of course there are great coaches that aren't in the building. Nobody can deny that more opportunities exist when the guy is in the building and the more opportunities the better. Not just study hall. Lunch, the hallway, the parking lot. The coach can wander into study hall, gym class, etc on his planning period. Also, I'll give a football a player a study hall even if they don't always need it. If they get good grades and are in college prep classes and doing well you don't think they could use an occasional 45 minutes to chill. They have a part time job after school. It's called football. They're kids. They have plenty of time to work their butts off when they're our age. One study hall isn't going to kill their Ivy League chances. They have a half-hour to "chill" at lunch. The boys should be challenging themselves, just as everyone else should. Does everyone else just get a 45-minute chill-out session, or just players? Lots of students have part-time jobs during the school year, whether you include varsity athletics as a "job" or not. I agree that having the coach present and visible in the halls everyday is an ideal situation vs. not having the HC present. However, my whole point was that the school community doesn't own their HC's soul and has no right to demand he work there full time if he'd rather work elsewhere. I also agree with the coach wandering the halls during his/her planning period, but maybe limit it to one day a week. If I, as a coach, did that everyday, I'd figure I'd have colleagues wondering what the hell I do all day to have so much time to waste in the halls. |
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Post by greenman on Jul 20, 2017 20:45:46 GMT -5
Well the example of Patrick Henry was just brought up a few posts ago and I brought up Hawkins at Galion at the beginning of the thread. Those are 2 specific examples. Didn't Hawkin's say it was hard to tell his players that they should be at practice on time every day when he couldn't always be there on time? He shouldn't have felt bad. He was an adult at his job and trying his best to get there, not horsing around in the locker room or the halls. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2017 21:11:39 GMT -5
Agree to disagree. If you want to minimize the time your coach is exposed to your kids then he shouldn't be the guy, IMO. Give me an specific example where less contact is better. Change my mind. I would not try to change your mind, I would only ask you to look at the number of head coaches for all sports that are successful in today's high schools that are not high school teachers. That was not the case 40 - 30 or 20 years ago. |
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Post by galion on Jul 21, 2017 3:35:25 GMT -5
If you hire a good coach it won't matter where he/she works at. Your program will flourish. If you don't they can walk the halls of your high school until they're blue in the face and it won't matter one lick.
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Post by kingmartinez on Jul 21, 2017 6:36:44 GMT -5
He is from Ada, correct? #2 - did someone really think he'd stay at Willard any longer than he has to? Once he believes his career is resuscitated, I'm sure most think he's gonzo.
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ScottT
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Post by ScottT on Jul 21, 2017 7:14:04 GMT -5
Setting aside the "in the halls/not in the halls argument for just a minute...Ada to Willard and vice-versa...Yikes, that's quite a haul, about an hour and 15 minutes or so each way!
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Post by 1percenter on Jul 21, 2017 8:26:40 GMT -5
Once he believes his career is resuscitatedHe went 1-9 last year |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 21, 2017 9:09:44 GMT -5
Setting aside the "in the halls/not in the halls argument for just a minute...Ada to Willard and vice-versa...Yikes, that's quite a haul, about an hour and 15 minutes or so each way! Is it possible in his ADA position that he could be teaching multiple classes all before 2pm or only 2-3 days a week? |
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