Aaron Judge Questions and Comments

[sportsjock]

No attempt to diminish his historical achievement, but I have lingering questions/
I'm assuming they play a lot more games today, than Aaron, Ruth, Mantle and all the others.
I have attempted to get these statistical comparisons and had no luck.
My question is, how many at bats, per home run compared to the all-time home hitters?

[Deleted]

Wasn't he a skinny little runt a short time ago ? And now he's this huge guy setting records, Kinda like Mark McGuire.

[browns624]

Oct 6, 2022 13:44:48 GMT -5 @markmay said:

Wasn't he a skinny little runt a short time ago ? And now he's this huge guy setting records, Kinda like Mark McGuire.

Don't recall Judge has always been built like a NFL TE from what I can remember 

[sithbucknut77]

Oct 6, 2022 13:44:48 GMT -5 @markmay said:

Wasn't he a skinny little runt a short time ago ? And now he's this huge guy setting records, Kinda like Mark McGuire.

He was that big in high school. And its only an American League and team record.
.

[sithbucknut77]

Oct 6, 2022 8:13:55 GMT -5 sportsjock said:

No attempt to diminish his historical achievement, but I have lingering questions/
I'm assuming they play a lot more games today, than Aaron, Ruth, Mantle and all the others.
I have attempted to get these statistical comparisons and had no luck.
My question is, how many at bats, per home run compared to the all-time home hitters?

I pulled some numbers based on some of the names you mentioned.  These will be single season type numbers since the thread is about what Judge has done this season.  I grabbed the names you mentioned plus a couple other big single season moments.  

Also for reference, MLB went to the 162 game schedule in 1961.  That change is what prompted much of the controversy when Maris and Mantle were chasing Ruth's 60 HR record. 

First some definitions: HR/PA = home runs per plate appearance, plate appearances include everything such as walks and hit by pitch.  OPS+ = on base % + slugging % normalized over the whole league.  This is a measure of power and ability to get on base with the league comparison with a number of 100 being the league average.  wRC+ is very similar to OPS+ but adds the additional measure of park effects.  Again league average = 100.  WAR = is wins above replacement as calculated by Fangraphs, to oversimplify, it is meant to be how valuable said player is over the average replacement. 

Aaron Judge 2022 - 62 HR
HR/PA 11.2; OPS+ 211; wRC+ 207; WAR 11.7

Barry Bonds 2001 - 73 HR
HR/PA 9.1; OPS+ 259; wRC+ 235; WAR 12.5

Babe Ruth 1927 - 60 HR
HR/PA 11.5; OPS+ 225; wRC+ 212; WAR 12.0

Roger Maris 1961 - 61 HR
HR/PA 11.4; OPS+ 167; wRC+ 162; WAR 7.1

Mickey Mantle 1961 - 54 HR
HR/PA 11.9; OPS+ 206; wRC+ 196; WAR 10.3

Mark McGwire 1998 - 70 HR
HR/PA 9.7; OPS+ 216; wRC+ 205; WAR 8.5

Hank Aaron 1971(age 37 season & highest single season total) - 47 HR
HR/PA 12.2; OPS+ 194; wRC+ 191; WAR 7.1

The plate appearance stat is pretty straight forward with Bonds and McGwire as outliers almost assuredly due to PDE's.  Those arguments are for another thread.  I find the OPS+ and/or wRC+ stats interesting because it tells how the individuals season stacks up against their in-season peers and the overall hitting environment.  IMO Judge's 2022 is very comparable to most of the great, high HR total single seasons ever produced.  

[buckeyefan73]

Barry Bonds has the real record, that’s all that needs to be said.

[sportsjock]

Thanks for the exact data I was looking for, sithbucknut77.
The OPS pretty much reveals strikout ratio, that would have been helpful.
OBP realistically reveals a players true value to the team.
Great power hitters may whiff the ball a lot and not produce a sufficient number of RBI's, compared to a clutch hitter producing with men on base.

[jakethesnake2]

Oct 6, 2022 20:25:38 GMT -5 buckeyefan73 said:

Barry Bonds has the real record, that’s all that needs to be said.

real record?

He cheated

[sithbucknut77]

Oct 7, 2022 10:54:35 GMT -5 jakethesnake2 said:

Oct 6, 2022 20:25:38 GMT -5 buckeyefan73 said:

Barry Bonds has the real record, that’s all that needs to be said.

real record?

He cheated

Yes...its the real record.

No one cares about the cheating except holier than thou baseball writers, certainly MLB turned a blind eye during the whole era(as did the writers).  How valid was Ruth's record before integration?  How about the methamphetamines widely used by players from the 40's through the 70's?  

No one is clean...

[Birdman]

Oct 7, 2022 12:24:34 GMT -5 sithbucknut77 said:

Oct 7, 2022 10:54:35 GMT -5 jakethesnake2 said:

real record?

He cheated

Yes...its the real record.

No one cares about the cheating except holier than thou baseball writers, certainly MLB turned a blind eye during the whole era(as did the writers).  How valid was Ruth's record before integration?  How about the methamphetamines widely used by players from the 40's through the 70's?  

No one is clean...

im with Jake.

Regardless of cheating, PED’s, and mentions of all kinds of things to scuff up an era or record, Bonds only got that record because he was juicing. Worst part of it, he doesn’t have the guts to just admit it and move on. No one likes a dirty player who obtains a record, no matter what era they played it. Do it clean or don’t do it at all.

Sports writers and critics aren’t the only one that care about PED’s. Scumbag Bonds is how I reflect on him now. He had a choice to do it the right way or the easy way and he choose the east way.

[Vogel]

Cheaters don't hold records in other sports. MLB shouldn't allow cheaters to hold records in MLB
1988 Ben Johnson ran a 9.79 to set the World Record. He was later caught cheating and record revoked.
2002 Tim Montgomery ran a 9.78 to set the World Record. He was later caught cheating and the record revoked.

Lance Armstrong won the Tour De France 7 straight times. He was later caught cheating and all those titles were revoked.


Bonds, McGwire, Sosa, A-Rod, etc were all cheaters.


It's super easy to see when the cheating ramped up
1982 - 0 players had 40+ HR's (leader 39 - Jackson & Thomas)
1983 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 40 Schmidt)
1984 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 43 Armas)
1985 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 40 Evans)
1986 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 40 Barfield)
1987 - 4 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 49 McGwire)
1988 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 42 Canseco)
1989 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 47 Mitchell)
1990 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 51 Fielder)
1991 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 44 Fielder, Canseco)
1992 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 43 Gonzalez)
1993 - 5 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 46 Gonzalez)
1994 - strike shortened 112 games (9 guys on pace for 40+)
1995 - strike shortened 144 games (9 guys on pace for 40+)
1996 - 16 players had 40+ HR's (2 had 50+ - leader 52 McGwire)
1997 - 12 players had 40+ HR's (2 had 50+ - leader 58 McGwire)
1998 - 13 players had 40+ HR's (4 had 50+ - leader 70 McGwire)
1999 - 13 players had 40+ HR's (4 had 50+ - leader 65 McGwire)
2000 - 16 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 50 Sosa)
2001 - 12 players had 40+ HR's (4 had 50+ - leader 73 Bonds)
2002 - 8 players had 40+ HR's (2 had 50+ - leader 57 Rodriguez)
2003 - 10 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 47 Rodriguez)
2004 - 9 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 48 Beltre)
2005 - 9 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 51 Jones)
2006 - 11 players had 40+ HR's (2 had 50+ - leader 58 Howard)
2007 - 5 players had 40+ HR's (2 had 50+ - leader 54 Rodriguez)
2008 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 48 Howard)
2009 - 5 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 49 Pujols)
2010 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 54 Bautista)
2011 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 43 Bautista)
2012 - 6 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 44 Cabrera)
2013 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 53 Davis)
2014 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 40 Cruz)
2015 - 9 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 47 Davis)
2016 - 8 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 47 Trumbo)
2017 - 4 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 59 Stanton)
2018 - 3 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 48 Davis)
2019 - 10 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 53 Alonso)


The 100 meter record is also telling
9.95 - 1968 - Jim Hines
9.93 - 1983 - Calvin Smith
9.83 - 1987 - Ben Johnson - oops caught cheating - record repealed
9.93 - 1988 - Carl Lewis
9.79 - 1988 - Ben Johnson - oops caught cheating - record repealed
9.92 - 1988 - Carl Lewis
9.90 - 1991 - Leroy Burrell
9.86 - 1991 - Carl Lewis
9.85 - 1994 - Leroy Burrell
9.84 - 1996 - Donovan Bailey
9.79 - 1999 - Maurice Greene
9.78 - 2002 - Tim Montgomery - oops caught cheating - record repealed
9.77 - 2005 - Asafa Powell
9.77 - 2006 - Justin Gatlin - oops caught cheating - record repealed
9.77 - 2006 - Asafa Powell - again
9.77 - 2006 - Asafa Powell - again
9.72 - 2008 - Usain Bolt
9.69 - 2008 - Usain Bolt
9.58 - 2009 - Usain Bolt

If you think Maurice Greene didn't cheat or Asafa Powell and Usain Bolt didn't then you most likely think Bonds and McGwire were 100% natural. Any time under 9.9 in the 100 meters is very suspect.

The only people that went under 9.90 in the steroid era were steroid users.

"Then there are chemicals that you take a couple of hours before the race that prevent acidification in the muscles. Together with epo they are an absolute miracle. I’ve created 20 different drugs that are still undetectable for the doping testers." - Angel Heredia, 2008

And more from Heredia in 2008


"SPIEGEL: Mr. Heredia, will you watch the 100 meter final in Beijing?

Heredia: Of course. But the winner will not be clean. Not even any of the contestants will be clean.

SPIEGEL: Of eight runners ...

Heredia: ... eight will be doped.

SPIEGEL: There is no way to prove that.

Heredia: There is no doubt about it. The difference between 10.0 and 9.7 seconds is the drugs."

[Birdman]

Oct 9, 2022 13:47:17 GMT -5 Vogel said:

Cheaters don't hold records in other sports. MLB shouldn't allow cheaters to hold records in MLB
1988 Ben Johnson ran a 9.79 to set the World Record. He was later caught cheating and record revoked.
2002 Tim Montgomery ran a 9.78 to set the World Record. He was later caught cheating and the record revoked.

Lance Armstrong won the Tour De France 7 straight times. He was later caught cheating and all those titles were revoked.


Bonds, McGwire, Sosa, A-Rod, etc were all cheaters.


It's super easy to see when the cheating ramped up
1982 - 0 players had 40+ HR's (leader 39 - Jackson & Thomas)
1983 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 40 Schmidt)
1984 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 43 Armas)
1985 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 40 Evans)
1986 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 40 Barfield)
1987 - 4 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 49 McGwire)
1988 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 42 Canseco)
1989 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 47 Mitchell)
1990 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 51 Fielder)
1991 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 44 Fielder, Canseco)
1992 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 43 Gonzalez)
1993 - 5 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 46 Gonzalez)
1994 - strike shortened 112 games (9 guys on pace for 40+)
1995 - strike shortened 144 games (9 guys on pace for 40+)
1996 - 16 players had 40+ HR's (2 had 50+ - leader 52 McGwire)
1997 - 12 players had 40+ HR's (2 had 50+ - leader 58 McGwire)
1998 - 13 players had 40+ HR's (4 had 50+ - leader 70 McGwire)
1999 - 13 players had 40+ HR's (4 had 50+ - leader 65 McGwire)
2000 - 16 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 50 Sosa)
2001 - 12 players had 40+ HR's (4 had 50+ - leader 73 Bonds)
2002 - 8 players had 40+ HR's (2 had 50+ - leader 57 Rodriguez)
2003 - 10 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 47 Rodriguez)
2004 - 9 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 48 Beltre)
2005 - 9 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 51 Jones)
2006 - 11 players had 40+ HR's (2 had 50+ - leader 58 Howard)
2007 - 5 players had 40+ HR's (2 had 50+ - leader 54 Rodriguez)
2008 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 48 Howard)
2009 - 5 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 49 Pujols)
2010 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 54 Bautista)
2011 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 43 Bautista)
2012 - 6 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 44 Cabrera)
2013 - 2 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 53 Davis)
2014 - 1 player had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 40 Cruz)
2015 - 9 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 47 Davis)
2016 - 8 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 47 Trumbo)
2017 - 4 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 59 Stanton)
2018 - 3 players had 40+ HR's (0 had 50+ - leader 48 Davis)
2019 - 10 players had 40+ HR's (1 had 50+ - leader 53 Alonso)


The 100 meter record is also telling
9.95 - 1968 - Jim Hines
9.93 - 1983 - Calvin Smith
9.83 - 1987 - Ben Johnson - oops caught cheating - record repealed
9.93 - 1988 - Carl Lewis
9.79 - 1988 - Ben Johnson - oops caught cheating - record repealed
9.92 - 1988 - Carl Lewis
9.90 - 1991 - Leroy Burrell
9.86 - 1991 - Carl Lewis
9.85 - 1994 - Leroy Burrell
9.84 - 1996 - Donovan Bailey
9.79 - 1999 - Maurice Greene
9.78 - 2002 - Tim Montgomery - oops caught cheating - record repealed
9.77 - 2005 - Asafa Powell
9.77 - 2006 - Justin Gatlin - oops caught cheating - record repealed
9.77 - 2006 - Asafa Powell - again
9.77 - 2006 - Asafa Powell - again
9.72 - 2008 - Usain Bolt
9.69 - 2008 - Usain Bolt
9.58 - 2009 - Usain Bolt

If you think Maurice Greene didn't cheat or Asafa Powell and Usain Bolt didn't then you most likely think Bonds and McGwire were 100% natural. Any time under 9.9 in the 100 meters is very suspect.

The only people that went under 9.90 in the steroid era were steroid users.

"Then there are chemicals that you take a couple of hours before the race that prevent acidification in the muscles. Together with epo they are an absolute miracle. I’ve created 20 different drugs that are still undetectable for the doping testers." - Angel Heredia, 2008

And more from Heredia in 2008


"SPIEGEL: Mr. Heredia, will you watch the 100 meter final in Beijing?

Heredia: Of course. But the winner will not be clean. Not even any of the contestants will be clean.

SPIEGEL: Of eight runners ...

Heredia: ... eight will be doped.

SPIEGEL: There is no way to prove that.

Heredia: There is no doubt about it. The difference between 10.0 and 9.7 seconds is the drugs."

The only thing I don’t agree with is the theory that Bolt had to cheat to run those times. He is a rare rare breed of track athletes. I believe his times are legit and non-PED fueled.

[Willard Fillmore]

HR - Judge 62, Ramirez 29

Batting Ave. - Judge .311, Ramirez .280

RBI - Judge 131, Ramirez 127

Judge got 33 more RBI than Jose by scoring on his home runs. Judge's batting average was 31 points higher than Jose's  This tells me Judge hit a lot of home runs with no one on base. Jose's homer runs and hits came with runners on base in critical situations. Judge's season was more about breaking the record than anything else. 

[Willard Fillmore]

Oct 6, 2022 13:44:48 GMT -5 @markmay said:

Wasn't he a skinny little runt a short time ago ? And now he's this huge guy setting records, Kinda like Mark McGuire.

McGuire was a lot skinnier than Judge when they came into the league. So was Jim Thome. 

[buckeyefan73]

You know the saying if you’re not cheating you’re not trying.

[Willard Fillmore]

If you cheat at poker or pool you could get shot or stabbed

[buckeyefan73]

That’s why people shouldn’t be playing stupid card games.

[sportsjock]

Most of the greats of the past several decades have used PED's in some form or other.
Some simply never got caught, as there are various means to conceal their presence.
Hell, caffeine was a banned substance at one time.

[Willard Fillmore]

Judge is 0-8 with 7 strike outs in this series against the Guards

[mcm1019]

He's also 2 for 37 with 27 strikeouts in career playoff games vs Cleveland.