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Post by 419bossman on Sept 27, 2021 13:13:49 GMT -5
Thoughts on the upcoming season?
Highland joins the league
Many new coaches for this year
Galion
Shelby
Ontario
Marion Harding
Is Shelby still the team to beat even with what they lost from last year?
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Post by dude on Sept 27, 2021 13:43:03 GMT -5
New coaches at each.
Shelby could be at the top of the MOAC for a couple more years. (more to do with the talent than the coach)
Galion could be better (new coach may get some new faces to the roster)
Ontario may be looking at Madison success (research the recent Madison records)
Marion toss up (They have D1 enrollment but D3 participation. Will see if new coach can change that)
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Post by 419bossman on Sept 27, 2021 15:49:38 GMT -5
This is how I see it
Shelby
River valley
Marion Pleasant
Marion Harding
Ontario
Clear Fork
Highland
Galion
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Post by dude on Sept 27, 2021 15:59:15 GMT -5
This is how I see it Shelby River valley Marion Pleasant Marion Harding Ontario Clear Fork Highland Galion Shelby ... River Valley Marion Harding Marion Pleasant
Clear ForkOntario Highland Galion |
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Post by 419bossman on Sept 28, 2021 10:14:59 GMT -5
Looking at the record for Highland last year, they finished with a 4-10 record. So I don't have them making any noise in conference this year
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Post by dude on Sept 28, 2021 10:27:21 GMT -5
Looking at the record for Highland last year, they finished with a 4-10 record. So I don't have them making any noise in conference this year Last year's teams were being shut down all season long. Some teams were hit much harder than others. |
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Post by moacpops on Oct 5, 2021 19:27:23 GMT -5
Overall - MOAC might be the weakest year in conference history. I don't see any MOAC team making it to the district finals.
Shelby - champs until beaten but the loss of Pugh and Lantz may be too much to overcome. New coach may be good or bad. Have athletes but after deferring to Pugh for three years who will step forward?
River valley - may dethrone the Whippets. Loaded with talent in HS and MS. Will be at the top of the MOAC over the next five years.
Marion Pleasant - some skilled young players but lack the athletes (see football team and other fall sports records). Spartan athletics in uncharted waters with the wins/losses.
Marion Harding - will be near the top with Stokes returning. Will the new coach get more from the athletes they do have? Marion has the dreaded P word. Potential.
Ontario - post Balogh reality sets in. Down go the Warriors. Middle of the pack this year.
Clear Fork - 8-15 a season ago. Going .500 would be a good year.
Highland - Scots are bad. Won 3 games in the KMAC a year ago. If you can't beat those teams, Highland wont win a lot of MOAC games. A 5-14 Mount Gilead team beat Highland by 20+. R Valley and Ontario both beat Highland by 30+ a year ago.
Galion - 34 straight losses I believe. Last win was over Mt. Gilead. 0-22 last year and 4-43 the last two seasons. I say the Tigers win three games this year.
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Post by 419bossman on Oct 6, 2021 12:45:39 GMT -5
I think you hit the nail on the head for the season. Ontario could still be near the top. don't get me wrong the new coach will probably lose some games but it is still Ontario and it does have the tradition and the JV and Freshmen teams weren't that bad to I can see them winning between 13-16 games.
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Oct 6, 2021 17:49:08 GMT -5
Much more about what returns at Ontario than Balogh retiring. They lose 7 Seniors. No starters return and only 2 lettermen off the bench. Add to that an average JV team that had 5 Juniors on it. They also lost their best Freshman, who was getting minutes on the JV team. A 6-4 kid who moved. They also lost their JV coach of over 30 years, one of two Varsity assistants and their Freshman coach. A complete changing of the guard. With the schedule they have, Joe would have a hard time getting to .500
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Post by dude on Oct 6, 2021 20:38:09 GMT -5
I think you hit the nail on the head for the season. Ontario could still be near the top. don't get me wrong the new coach will probably lose some games but it is still Ontario and it does have the tradition and the JV and Freshmen teams weren't that bad to I can see them winning between 13-16 games. The HOF coach had multiple returning starters and a 4 year letterman to win 15 regular season games and you think a below .500 coach will take a team with no returning starters to the same results.? |
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Post by shelbyrr11 on Oct 6, 2021 21:13:11 GMT -5
If the MOAC is very down this year, which is utterly believable, I can see an Ontario team getting 8-10 wins from conference play. Just split the non-con. No idea who Ontario has in non-con.
Shelby returns many talented role players from last year. There is a chance some of the younger guys step up and make the season fun. District Finals would be an accomplishment...but the homer in me says that isn't completely preposterous.
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Post by dude on Oct 6, 2021 21:27:02 GMT -5
Shelby returns many talented role players from last year. There is a chance some of the younger guys step up and make the season fun. District Finals would be an accomplishment...but the homer in me says that isn't completely preposterous. Shelby without Pugh should still be a very good team. But in many ways Pugh generated points for other players when he was on the floor. |
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Post by shelbyrr11 on Oct 6, 2021 21:43:23 GMT -5
Yep. Pugh made things easier for many. Hill, Holloway, and Shepherd are all capable players, but they handsomely benefitted from Pugh who could wear down defenders with his ability to drive and make those 4-8 foot buckets or distribute. His passing will be missed. I think Brazure Roberts is a kid who could benefit from a more distributed offense. I'm looking towards Bruskotter, Ramsey, and Brubaker as JV/Varsity players who could step up in a notable fashion.
Point stands though: making the District Finals is hard. Shelby lost an all-timer and a very helpful battery mate in Lantz. With that and a new coach, we'll be looking at a very different Whippet squad. It will be interesting to see how players fill in the new roles.
I only know things about the new coach via a friend. There aren't any concerns from the ability to take a program under his helm. In that same breath, I shouldn't feel too worried about schemes and insight. I think the Whippets will still be a notch above where they were before the previous coach took over. Hard to say for sure until it happens.
Via the Shelby Schools website, the non-conference appears to be:
Madison
Lexington
Granville
Willard
Ashland
Wooster
Mansfield
Upper Sandusky
I think that non-con is entirely adequate for exposing what we can or cannot do as a team this season, as opposed to what Ontario/River Valley and whoever else steps up in the MOAC.
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Post by moacpops on Oct 6, 2021 23:35:07 GMT -5
Shelby, River Valley and Harding SHOULD start the season expecting they will sweep Highland, Galion, CF, and Pleasant. That’s 8 easy conference wins for those top 3 teams. Ontario will be way down from the years past so I think the top 3 teams have 10 conference wins secured worst case. I look at Shelby, Valley and Harding playing each other four times. Win 3 of 4 and you win the MOAC. Win 2 of 4 and you may get a share of the MOAC. MOAC teams will win non conf games versus smaller schools but struggle in similar school size matchups and in the tournament. I hope teams surprise us and the conference is better than we think.
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Post by moacpops on Oct 6, 2021 23:38:57 GMT -5
Shelby returns many talented role players from last year. There is a chance some of the younger guys step up and make the season fun. District Finals would be an accomplishment...but the homer in me says that isn't completely preposterous. Shelby without Pugh should still be a very good team. But in many ways Pugh generated points for other players when he was on the floor. And Lantz took pressure off those role guys as well. When teams tried to man up the role players saw teams third best defenders at best. |
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Post by dude on Oct 7, 2021 0:20:27 GMT -5
Shelby without Pugh should still be a very good team. But in many ways Pugh generated points for other players when he was on the floor. And Lantz took pressure off those role guys as well. When teams tried to man up the role players saw teams third best defenders at best. From my view I would put Lantz in the category of a role player. |
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Post by fanofthegame on Oct 7, 2021 4:21:29 GMT -5
And Lantz took pressure off those role guys as well. When teams tried to man up the role players saw teams third best defenders at best. From my view I would put Lantz in the category of a role player. I think Rio Grande disagrees. Not a lot of high school “roll players” get scholarship money thrown at them for basketball. |
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Post by fanofthegame on Oct 7, 2021 4:27:16 GMT -5
I’ve seen Shelby’s new head coach interact with players in his roll as a football coach. I think he’ll do well based on that. I’ve got to guess he has a decent understanding of the game since he played at the college level. Clearly losing Pugh and Lantz are going to affect the team. I don’t think they have anyone head and shoulders above the others. I believe they will have a very solid eight or nine player rotation. I think the challenge will be managing expectations since there are a couple of very talented sophomores, but for the first time in a while there isn’t a need for the underclassmen to move up.
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Post by dude on Oct 7, 2021 7:32:19 GMT -5
From my view I would put Lantz in the category of a role player. I think Rio Grande disagrees. Not a lot of high school “roll players” get scholarship money thrown at them for basketball. Yes they do, That's how NAIA schools get their rosters full. Another role player from your area, Gurney, was a scholarship player at an NAIA school. The term role player is not a degrading term. And maybe at URG he will become the alpha on the team. But at Shelby, in my view, he was a role player that benefited from their alpha. |
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Post by fanofthegame on Oct 7, 2021 9:13:13 GMT -5
I think Rio Grande disagrees. Not a lot of high school “roll players” get scholarship money thrown at them for basketball. Yes they do, That's how NAIA schools get their rosters full. Another role player from your area, Gurney, was a scholarship player at an NAIA school. The term role player is not a degrading term. And maybe at URG he will become the alpha on the team. But at Shelby, in my view, he was a role player that benefited from their alpha. We probably agree if we clarify terms. A high school roll player in my mind doesn’t play at the next level. You’re probably the best player on your high school team if you play in college UNLESS you have two college caliber players on your high school team (which in rural Ohio is pretty rare). I wouldn’t necessarily call him a high school roll player, just the second best college caliber player on last year’s team. |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Oct 7, 2021 9:53:40 GMT -5
And Lantz took pressure off those role guys as well. When teams tried to man up the role players saw teams third best defenders at best. From my view I would put Lantz in the category of a role player. A "role player" is not the 2nd most important player on a District Finals team. My idea of a "role player" is the best defensive player on a team that scores 6-8 PPG. OR the best rebounder on a team that is not counted on to score more than on put backs. Those real "role players" do not play basketball in college except on rec teams. |
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Post by dude on Oct 7, 2021 10:56:19 GMT -5
My term of role player, since I was the one who said it and used it. Is any player that supports the team in any way specific or general. But this player is not the alpha player who can successfully carry a team for the season. Some teams, in my view, only have role players and it can work. Maybe you see it as supporting players But most all successful teams have, in my terms, an alpha player with role/supporting players. True there are good teams that have multiple alphas that can win and win a lot.
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Oct 7, 2021 23:29:10 GMT -5
If Pugh didn't play for Shelby, Lantz would have averaged 20ppg and been on a higher All-Ohio player and not considered a "role player". For that he was a great team player.
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Oct 8, 2021 0:06:39 GMT -5
From my view I would put Lantz in the category of a role player. A "role player" is not the 2nd most important player on a District Finals team. My idea of a "role player" is the best defensive player on a team that scores 6-8 PPG. OR the best rebounder on a team that is not counted on to score more than on put backs. Those real "role players" do not play basketball in college except on rec teams. Was Hoepner or Scholl a role player in 88-89? Was Kreisher a role player to Sanderson? Kreisher averaged more, but Sanderson played for Ohio State Was Willeke a role player? Was D'Quan Hillary a role player? Ricky Minard or Herman Davis who was the role player? Matt Smith was 2nd team All-Ohio and started 3 years for DI Robert Morris, was he a role player? He averaged 13ppg when a Senior in high school. |
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Post by fanofthegame on Oct 8, 2021 6:41:52 GMT -5
My OCD requires that I acknowledge that I used the word roll when it should have been role. Dang English language.
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Oct 8, 2021 10:52:49 GMT -5
I was on a roll there....lol. Thanks I'll correct
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Post by fanofthegame on Oct 8, 2021 11:41:16 GMT -5
When you are a hillbilly, river rat from Southern Ohio you tend to overcompensate with correct grammar to prove you aren’t as dumb as most people think you are 😂😂😂.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 8, 2021 13:00:04 GMT -5
If Pugh didn't play for Shelby, Lantz would have averaged 20ppg and been on a higher All-Ohio player and not considered a "role player". For that he was a great team player. Agreed Lantz would have averaged 20ppg or even more. But struggle to win a district title without Pugh. And wouldn’t win 20 games… which without those two things puts a hinder on raising his stock as an all Ohio candidate. But the young man is far from a “role player”. And doing something very few athletes get to do and that’s go to college and have it paid for! |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Oct 8, 2021 16:14:03 GMT -5
When you are a hillbilly, river rat from Southern Ohio you tend to overcompensate with correct grammar to prove you aren’t as dumb as most people think you are 😂😂😂. Are you sure you weren't from Olive Hill?  |
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Post by dude on Oct 10, 2021 18:06:21 GMT -5
If Pugh didn't play for Shelby, Lantz would have averaged 20ppg and been on a higher All-Ohio player and not considered a "role player". For that he was a great team player. Agreed Lantz would have averaged 20ppg or even more. But struggle to win a district title without Pugh. And wouldn’t win 20 games… which without those two things puts a hinder on raising his stock as an all Ohio candidate. But the young man is far from a “role player”. And doing something very few athletes get to do and that’s go to college and have it paid for! Without Pugh on the roster, if Lantz would have been the top target to defend, I disagree his PPG would have increased. We can agree to disagree. It could be argued that Pugh saw the best defense teams had and he averaged 25 PPG. Lantz probably saw the second or third best defender in most cases and averaged 15 PPG. Most teams do not have many good defenders. I give Lantz much credit for his game and accomplishments. |
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