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Post by Willard Fillmore on Apr 18, 2021 22:16:22 GMT -5
Also competed against Highland, Buckeye Valley and North Union, all considerably larger. Buckeye Valley has no football tradition. At all. If I recall correctly, as by far the largest school in the old MOAC they never one a single league title. I could be wrong but I seem to remember that being a talking point. When Pleasant was beating up on Highland and North Union they were considerably smaller schools. North Union was a small DV. Highland a small DIV. This past year, Highland and Clear Fork 8th grade football teams absolutely obliterated Pleasant. This "down" has the potential to be a longer period of time. Now wait just a minute. You're the one saying Pleasant can't compete due to size, yet out of the other side of your mouth you say BV, a MUCH larger school, never has never had good football. Highland has never been close to Pleasant's size. One of the reasons North Union wanted out was due to small Pleasant always beating them Last year CF 8th grade beat the snot out of most schools on their schedule. The primary reason being everyone on their O-line was short squat and 250. Not sure how that will equate in high school, when linemen on other teams that were 5-11 180 grow taller and bigger in the weight rooms |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2021 7:31:52 GMT -5
Lucas year in and year out would not compete consistently in the MOAC in football READ what us written, I said "this year". Lucas the past several years would have competed quite well in football, in the MOAC. Then why reference one year of lucas playing in the MOAC? If the discussion is how Pleasant competed in the MOAC at a high level for years and now wants out |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2021 7:33:45 GMT -5
Lucas year in and year out would not compete consistently in the MOAC in football READ what us written, I said "this year". Lucas the past several years would have competed quite well in football, in the MOAC. I disagree, they wouldn't have the depth to play up that high of a schedule year in and year out. They are a solid program but in a sport like football, depth is also crucial. |
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Post by dude on Apr 19, 2021 8:03:22 GMT -5
READ what us written, I said "this year". Lucas the past several years would have competed quite well in football, in the MOAC. I disagree, they wouldn't have the depth to play up that high of a schedule year in and year out. They are a solid program but in a sport like football, depth is also crucial. The idea of Lucas being a consistent contender in the MOAC is crazy. Most from Lucas will tell you they have a nice wave of talent going thru right now. Even with that group they could not beat Galion or Shelby and barely handled a celebrated Ontario team, a bad Clear Fork team and a down Pleasant team. |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Apr 19, 2021 9:34:10 GMT -5
READ what us written, I said "this year". Lucas the past several years would have competed quite well in football, in the MOAC. I disagree, they wouldn't have the depth to play up that high of a schedule year in and year out. They are a solid program but in a sport like football, depth is also crucial. Again....READ what is written. I said the past several years. NOT "year in and year out". If Lucas makes runs to the Regional Finals and State Finals they can "compete" in the MOAC. Which does not mean they have to win a league title or finish 2nd to "compete". |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Apr 19, 2021 9:46:31 GMT -5
I disagree, they wouldn't have the depth to play up that high of a schedule year in and year out. They are a solid program but in a sport like football, depth is also crucial. The idea of Lucas being a consistent contender in the MOAC is crazy. Most from Lucas will tell you they have a nice wave of talent going thru right now. Even with that group they could not beat Galion or Shelby and barely handled a celebrated Ontario team, a bad Clear Fork team and a down Pleasant team. Dude can't read either. I did not not say Lucas would be a "consistent contender". AGAIN...I said they could have competed in the MOAC the last several years. Not that Lucas should be in the MOAC, just comparatively speaking when talking about what DV Pleasant can do in a predominately DIV league when they have a good team by looking at what DVII Lucas did with a good team against MOAC teams. According to dude, a team must soundly win their games to be a contender. ROFL! Obviously Dude is what is crazy. Shelby beat Lucas soundly, as they did everyone this past year. Lucas most likely would have finished 2nd or 3rd in the MOAC last year, they would have "competed". "Celebrated Ontario team". Dude is a dolt. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2021 9:54:13 GMT -5
I disagree, they wouldn't have the depth to play up that high of a schedule year in and year out. They are a solid program but in a sport like football, depth is also crucial. Again....READ what is written. I said the past several years. NOT "year in and year out". If Lucas makes runs to the Regional Finals and State Finals they can "compete" in the MOAC. Which does not mean they have to win a league title or finish 2nd to "compete". so the topic where this originated was someone making the comment that Pleasant was able to compete "most" year in the MOAC and now they want out because of enrollment... you used Lucas competing in the MOAC as an example to counter that. |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Apr 19, 2021 10:05:58 GMT -5
Again....READ what is written. I said the past several years. NOT "year in and year out". If Lucas makes runs to the Regional Finals and State Finals they can "compete" in the MOAC. Which does not mean they have to win a league title or finish 2nd to "compete". so the topic where this originated was someone making the comment that Pleasant was able to compete "most" year in the MOAC and now they want out because of enrollment... you used Lucas competing in the MOAC as an example to counter that. EXACTLY and a sound analogy. Lucas is DVII, Pleasant is DV, the MOAC is predominately a DIV league. When Pleasant has good teams, playing up will make them better for the post season. That's what has fed Bellevue and Clyde's success in the tournament. |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Apr 19, 2021 10:12:15 GMT -5
Dude can't read either. I did not not say Lucas would be a "consistent contender". AGAIN...I said they could have competed in the MOAC the last several years. He would be what is crazy. Shelby beat Lucas soundly, as they did everyone this past year. Lucas most likely would have finished 2nd or 3rd in the MOAC last year, they would have competed. "Celebrated Ontario team". Dude is a dolt. Willard, you ever coach before? A few years as a nonpaid assistant. Not that it matters in this discussion, and you? |
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Post by dude on Apr 19, 2021 10:27:11 GMT -5
Dude can't read either. I did not not say Lucas would be a "consistent contender". AGAIN...I said they could have competed in the MOAC the last several years. He would be what is crazy. Shelby beat Lucas soundly, as they did everyone this past year. Lucas most likely would have finished 2nd or 3rd in the MOAC last year, they would have competed. "Celebrated Ontario team". Dude is a dolt. Willard, you ever coach before? Heaven help the kids if so. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2021 10:31:31 GMT -5
so the topic where this originated was someone making the comment that Pleasant was able to compete "most" year in the MOAC and now they want out because of enrollment... you used Lucas competing in the MOAC as an example to counter that. EXACTLY and a sound analogy. Lucas is DVII, Pleasant is DV, the MOAC is predominately a DIV league. When Pleasant has good teams, playing up will make them better for the post season. That's what has fed Bellevue and Clyde's success in the tournament. So, when I said Lucas would not be competitive year in and year out as a D7 team in that league you told me to READ but you just said they are your argument to counter the pleasant enrollment size. You have expanded from "this year" to "the last several years" so I just want to know you answer to this question. Would Lucas compete in the MOAC in football and all other sports, year in and year out? Also, this will depend on your definition of compete as I think it is meaning something different to all of us on here. For me compete is top 3 finish in said sport might be a good measuring stick??? Not sure what else to use when talking league only when defining compete |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2021 10:36:01 GMT -5
Also,
If Pleasant does leave to say the N10 as has been mentioned they inquired on here. Would the MOAC add Lex if they applied. Haven't they shown interest in the past?
I think it would make sense as now the schools would be even closer in enrollment if that is the issue.
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Post by guy on Apr 19, 2021 10:49:02 GMT -5
Also, If Pleasant does leave to say the N10 as has been mentioned they inquired on here. Would the MOAC add Lex if they applied. Haven't they shown interest in the past? I think it would make sense as now the schools would be even closer in enrollment if that is the issue. I'm not so sure the N10 would realistically want Pleasant, but I would bet Lex would certainly apply for the MOAC. |
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Post by dude on Apr 19, 2021 10:52:56 GMT -5
Also, If Pleasant does leave to say the N10 as has been mentioned they inquired on here. Would the MOAC add Lex if they applied. Haven't they shown interest in the past? I think it would make sense as now the schools would be even closer in enrollment if that is the issue. Before Highland was approved into the MOAC, Lexington sent a formal letter to the MOAC asking if they would be considered as an 8th member if available. The MOAC commissioner took the letter to a meeting and a vote was taken on if he should take action in talking with Lexington about a possible invite to the MOAC. Shelby and Clear Fork were the only schools 100% on board with moving forward. Marion County schools and Galion were a strong NO. This gave a majority against the idea of pursuing Lex, so the discussions stopped. |
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Post by dude on Apr 19, 2021 10:56:04 GMT -5
Also, If Pleasant does leave to say the N10 as has been mentioned they inquired on here. Would the MOAC add Lex if they applied. Haven't they shown interest in the past? I think it would make sense as now the schools would be even closer in enrollment if that is the issue. I'm not so sure the N10 would realistically want Pleasant, but I would bet Lex would certainly apply for the MOAC. You may lose that bet. Lex asked them once if they would be considered and it was voted down. It may be now that Lex would actually have to be invited before they would show interest. With some many things today being based on enrollment and travel, Lex in the MOAC makes perfect sense to many. |
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Post by moacpops on Apr 19, 2021 12:20:56 GMT -5
I don't know where this discussion derailed into a "Pleasant is looking to leave" thing. This is about Pleasant being down. I don't think the Spartans are looking to run from the MOAC competition. Lex would be a great fit with location and school size. Lex is really good athletically. Some other schools fear competition rather than embrace it.
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Post by dude on Apr 19, 2021 12:56:55 GMT -5
I don't know where this discussion derailed into a "Pleasant is looking to leave" thing. This is about Pleasant being down. I don't think the Spartans are looking to run from the MOAC competition. Lex would be a great fit with location and school size. Lex is really good athletically. Some other schools fear competition rather than embrace it.This is becoming a more factual statement every year. |
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Post by pirate80 on Apr 19, 2021 18:34:29 GMT -5
Buckeye Valley has no football tradition. At all. If I recall correctly, as by far the largest school in the old MOAC they never one a single league title. I could be wrong but I seem to remember that being a talking point. When Pleasant was beating up on Highland and North Union they were considerably smaller schools. North Union was a small DV. Highland a small DIV. This past year, Highland and Clear Fork 8th grade football teams absolutely obliterated Pleasant. This "down" has the potential to be a longer period of time. Now wait just a minute. You're the one saying Pleasant can't compete due to size, yet out of the other side of your mouth you say BV, a MUCH larger school, never has never had good football. Highland has never been close to Pleasant's size. One of the reasons North Union wanted out was due to small Pleasant always beating them Last year CF 8th grade beat the snot out of most schools on their schedule. The primary reason being everyone on their O-line was short squat and 250. Not sure how that will equate in high school, when linemen on other teams that were 5-11 180 grow taller and bigger in the weight rooms *Should*. BV should have dominated the original MOAC during all of its existence. They did not. Just like now, there is zero excuse for Harding to not dominate. None. For the first decade or so Highland was not much bigger than Pleasant at all. I played in this league at that time. Highland was DIV football and Pleasant was DV. They were both DIII in basketball. Very comparable. Yes, Clear Fork 8th grade class is very good at football. My original point in all of this was that Pleasant will continue to struggle in the new MOAC unless the enrollment grows. And that currently looks doubtful. Pleasant made their tradition, which I admire, by whooping schools their size (largely). By their standard, they are struggling now that they are in a league of schools bigger than them. That is all. |
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Post by runriot742 on Apr 19, 2021 21:21:33 GMT -5
I don't know where this discussion derailed into a "Pleasant is looking to leave" thing. This is about Pleasant being down. I don't think the Spartans are looking to run from the MOAC competition. Lex would be a great fit with location and school size. Lex is really good athletically. Some other schools fear competition rather than embrace it.This is becoming a more factual statement every year. Lol. The statement : "some other schools fear competition rather than embrace." , is too true. I agree, I don't think pleasant is looking to leave. It's a couple down years which are factually distinguishable to a coaching culture. I think pleasant will be alright in the long run. They are hard hitting kids, and always gave us a fight. I don't think that the lack of talent will last long. Often schools have a class or four which result in a material result which don't result in w/ls. I do think Lexington would be a good fit for the MOAC. I believe that they would be a good fit for the moac because of geography. Also, I believe they would be a good fit due to the fact that in the past they have scheduled other teams as non-con games. So it would be a good fit competitively. Lastly, if you go back to the 2000s, Lexington has a competitive football tradition. I sure hope pleasant doesn't leave. It would be a shame |
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Post by fanofthegame on Apr 19, 2021 21:43:00 GMT -5
Does size matter (that’s what she said)? Of course or the OHSAA wouldn’t divide schools up into divisions. Is it the end all, be all? Nope. Look at Clear Fork and their years in the OCC. I could go on and on with examples. Tough kids, tradition, coaching. All more important. Twenty extra kids in a grade my yield you one more real contributor on the field. We’re also not talking about a 2-3 division difference. They’re one division smaller than the bulk of the league.
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Apr 19, 2021 22:10:04 GMT -5
Willard, you ever coach before? Heaven help the kids if so. Heaven help dude if I had to coach him. |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Apr 19, 2021 22:15:06 GMT -5
Now wait just a minute. You're the one saying Pleasant can't compete due to size, yet out of the other side of your mouth you say BV, a MUCH larger school, never has never had good football. Highland has never been close to Pleasant's size. One of the reasons North Union wanted out was due to small Pleasant always beating them Last year CF 8th grade beat the snot out of most schools on their schedule. The primary reason being everyone on their O-line was short squat and 250. Not sure how that will equate in high school, when linemen on other teams that were 5-11 180 grow taller and bigger in the weight rooms For the first decade or so Highland was not much bigger than Pleasant at all. I played in this league at that time. Highland was DIV football and Pleasant was DV. They were both DIII in basketball. Very comparable. My original point in all of this was that Pleasant will continue to struggle in the new MOAC unless the enrollment grows. And that currently looks doubtful. Pleasant made their tradition, which I admire, by whooping schools their size (largely). By their standard, they are struggling now that they are in a league of schools bigger than them. That is all. Highland is still DIV and Pleasant is still DV. |
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Post by dude on Apr 19, 2021 22:18:34 GMT -5
A few years as a nonpaid assistant. Not that it matters in this discussion, and you? many moons ago as a varsity assistant in multiple sports. I was trying to get an idea on where your perspective might come from, thats all. Nonpaid assistant probably means an unwanted argument everyday at practice.  |
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Post by dude on Apr 19, 2021 22:23:44 GMT -5
Does size matter (that’s what she said)? Of course or the OHSAA wouldn’t divide schools up into divisions. Is it the end all, be all? Nope. Look at Clear Fork and their years in the OCC. I could go on and on with examples. Tough kids, tradition, coaching. All more important. Twenty extra kids in a grade my yield you one more real contributor on the field. We’re also not talking about a 2-3 division difference. They’re one division smaller than the bulk of the league. Correct, for many years Orville competed well in the OCC and nobody talked about their enrollment. |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Apr 19, 2021 22:27:57 GMT -5
EXACTLY and a sound analogy. Lucas is DVII, Pleasant is DV, the MOAC is predominately a DIV league. When Pleasant has good teams, playing up will make them better for the post season. That's what has fed Bellevue and Clyde's success in the tournament. So, when I said Lucas would not be competitive year in and year out as a D7 team in that league you told me to READ but you just said they are your argument to counter the pleasant enrollment size. You have expanded from "this year" to "the last several years" so I just want to know you answer to this question. Would Lucas compete in the MOAC in football and all other sports, year in and year out? Also, this will depend on your definition of compete as I think it is meaning something different to all of us on here. For me compete is top 3 finish in said sport might be a good measuring stick??? Not sure what else to use when talking league only when defining compete My position was/is/will be that Lucas could have competed in the MOAC the past several years. This is the football forum, thus I was proffering how they would do in football alone. As I have already pointed out "compete" for me means the same as you, except it does not ever require winning a league title, nor does it require finishing 2nd or 3rd every year. |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Apr 19, 2021 22:29:02 GMT -5
Does size matter (that’s what she said)? Of course or the OHSAA wouldn’t divide schools up into divisions. Is it the end all, be all? Nope. Look at Clear Fork and their years in the OCC. I could go on and on with examples. Tough kids, tradition, coaching. All more important. Twenty extra kids in a grade my yield you one more real contributor on the field. We’re also not talking about a 2-3 division difference. They’re one division smaller than the bulk of the league. Correct, for many years Orville competed well in the OCC and nobody talked about their enrollment. Until they started to. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2021 22:30:30 GMT -5
Does size matter (that’s what she said)? Of course or the OHSAA wouldn’t divide schools up into divisions. Is it the end all, be all? Nope. Look at Clear Fork and their years in the OCC. I could go on and on with examples. Tough kids, tradition, coaching. All more important. Twenty extra kids in a grade my yield you one more real contributor on the field. We’re also not talking about a 2-3 division difference. They’re one division smaller than the bulk of the league. Correct, for many years Orville competed well in the OCC and nobody talked about their enrollment. But yet they got out, same with CF in the OCC as someone mentioned. Although this conversation started when someone mentioned them inquiring to the N10 right now if I'm not mistaken |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Apr 19, 2021 22:31:09 GMT -5
many moons ago as a varsity assistant in multiple sports. I was trying to get an idea on where your perspective might come from, thats all. Nonpaid assistant probably means an unwanted argument everyday at practice. There were no dudes that required being put in their place  |
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Post by dude on Apr 19, 2021 22:36:45 GMT -5
Correct, for many years Orville competed well in the OCC and nobody talked about their enrollment. But yet they got out, same with CF in the OCC as someone mentioned. Although this conversation started when someone mentioned them inquiring to the N10 right now if I'm not mistaken When Orville stopped graduating college talent then their enrollment became an issue and they looked to leave. The CF move was driven by the football coach and his supporters. Many of the CF coaches liked the OCC. |
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Apr 19, 2021 22:36:57 GMT -5
Correct, for many years Orville competed well in the OCC and nobody talked about their enrollment. But yet they got out, same with CF in the OCC as someone mentioned. Although this conversation started when someone mentioned them inquiring to the N10 right now if I'm not mistaken Actually this conversation got started when pirate80, said he felt sorry for Pleasant. Which was rather odd, coming from someone that Pleasant thumped on a regular basis |
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