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Post by gridiron58 on Sept 2, 2017 20:37:13 GMT -5
Margaretta will not be forced to change leagues from River to Bay. They initially left the SBC for that River Conference. I think if they did get forced to move up, They'd leave the SBC and River league, for something else. I'm not sure where they'd go, But they wouldn't put up this. Like St. Mary's, they were the next one to cry how small they are, and couldn't compete. The Bears are happy to be where there at. But let's not forget, last year Edison started crying that too, and wanted into the River. If you don't understand why Div 7 St. Mary or Div 6 Margaretta wanted out of "the original, one division SBC" and wanted to stop getting their brains bashed in by schools like Div 3 Clyde & Perkins, then I really don't know what to tell you. You make it sound like it was unreasonable that St. Mary was "crying how small they are", when they have 61 boys compared to Clyde's 314 boys. Exactly how small does a school need to be to think a move is justified? With the additions of Gibsonburg, Danbury and Hopewell, it only makes sense for the largest school to get bumped to the Bay and that would be Div 5 Willard. Willard is about the same size as St. Mary and Margaretta combined. I don't know about Edison "crying, wanting into the River" but even if that was true, i'm guessing that was before there were 3 Divisions of the SBC.
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Post by greenman on Sept 2, 2017 21:16:23 GMT -5
Margaretta will not be forced to change leagues from River to Bay. They initially left the SBC for that River Conference. I think if they did get forced to move up, They'd leave the SBC and River league, for something else. I'm not sure where they'd go, But they wouldn't put up this. Like St. Mary's, they were the next one to cry how small they are, and couldn't compete. The Bears are happy to be where there at. But let's not forget, last year Edison started crying that too, and wanted into the River. Edison was crying last year? I don't recall that. As for SMCC, they've wanted out of the SBC for decades; if not officially, parents and even coaches have been heard complaining about it since at least the 80s. That was a fairly good decade for Panther athletics, as I recall, but I think some could see the writing on the wall as far as the school, and area Catholic schools, went. They understand that they can't be punching 2-3 divisions above their weight class anymore - money, not to mention this era's cultural value given to Catholic education, is in short supply in this immediate area. Margaretta? The football story is really just another story of a farming village on the wane, not unlike others in this area. If River only grows to 9, who's to say they couldn't play 8 division games w/in the conference while other divs. play 7 or less? What do we lose with unbalanced divisions, really? Crossovers are fine, but not vital. I'm not 100% sure that, at this point, they wouldn't accept a place in Bay Div. As you said, where else would they go? Also a factor (I feel): I hate to bring it up again and again like this, but truth be told, for school districts (and their athletic teams), open enrollment has proved to be a mixed bag, in terms of their athletic teams and school culture in general. In Erie Co., Kelley's Isl. is the only district not to offer OE at all - all others offer it not just to students living in adjacent districts, but students living anywhere. Sandusky and Huron Cos. are nearly the same. In my opinion, this makes the shuffle too easy, and too likely that talent will be on a revolving-door basis, whether it's centered in just one individual that comes in and leaves quickly, or in an athlete that leaves and another that arrives.
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Post by wallacefan on Sept 2, 2017 21:54:03 GMT -5
Margaretta will not be forced to change leagues from River to Bay. They initially left the SBC for that River Conference. I think if they did get forced to move up, They'd leave the SBC and River league, for something else. I'm not sure where they'd go, But they wouldn't put up this. Like St. Mary's, they were the next one to cry how small they are, and couldn't compete. The Bears are happy to be where there at. But let's not forget, last year Edison started crying that too, and wanted into the River. 1. Margaretta isn't being forced to change from the River to the Bay. Willard is. 2. If Margaretta did decide to leave the SBC, they have nowhere to go. Firelands won't take them (they asked when Ryan Bohn was AD). Margaretta is locked in. They need to take whatever is coming and like it. Being an independent is a lot worse. 3. Had heard that regarding Edison and their long-term demographics. But that won't happen either. 4. In reference to your earlier question about the River Division breaking off, they won't. But the early feedback was not good as the bigger SBC schools tried to throw their weight around. Left the Small schools with a bad taste in their mouths. But create a new conference is a LOT of work (more than most people know) and as long as the Lake and Bay don't try to force things down their throats, this is the best setup the River schools could ask for.
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Post by BellevueBuckeye on Sept 3, 2017 7:19:25 GMT -5
Margaretta is being forced to change from the River to the Bay. Wait, so does that mean Willard will stay in the River?
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Post by wallacefan on Sept 3, 2017 8:28:09 GMT -5
Margaretta is being forced to change from the River to the Bay. Wait, so does that mean Willard will stay in the River? Typo. Margaretta ISN'T being forced to move to the Bay. Sorry about that.
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Post by crimsonblooded on Sept 4, 2017 6:13:18 GMT -5
I would think the force would be Willard or Lakota. Heard Willard will be D6 again next count. Only problem is probably don't have enough time to schedule before new count. So looks like Willard will be going to the Bay. Current freshmen will be juniors and we will compete in the Bay in my opinion. No other sports in Willard will want to leave SBC for N10. Willard can drop Shelby for another FC school and we will be fine. Long Live the SBC!
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2112
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Post by 2112 on Sept 4, 2017 9:20:06 GMT -5
Knowing that a move to the Bay might be a possibility ushered in by taking HL, did Willard, Lakota, or Margaretta vote "no" on their application?
ALL of the schools in the new-look SBC know that shuffling around is a possibility as the league grows and stabilizes. It's not like any of them didn't know this from the start. So I don't buy into any of this "Lol just LOL if you think Willard is gonna stand to be shuffled up into the Bay" talk.
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Post by kingmartinez on Sept 4, 2017 10:39:21 GMT -5
Lakota will never be in the Bay. Willard is the obvious move then when/if it will be Margaretta despite any counts. They are already in the Bay for other sports. In addition, enrollment is not the only factor that is used (i.e. Shelby/Vermilion).
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2112
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Post by 2112 on Sept 4, 2017 10:52:31 GMT -5
Lakota will never be in the Bay. Willard is the obvious move then when/if it will be Margaretta despite any counts. They are already in the Bay for other sports. In addition, enrollment is not the only factor that is used (i.e. Shelby/Vermilion). Seems to me that if Willard & Margaretta want to avoid the shuffle they need to start beating that drum to get Genoa & Firelands into the conference sooner rather than later.
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chs71
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Post by chs71 on Sept 4, 2017 10:59:34 GMT -5
In addition, enrollment is not the only factor that is used (i.e. Shelby/Vermilion). Really? I was told that was. Boys enrollment only for football and total enrollment for all other sports. That's not correct?
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Post by 1percenter on Sept 4, 2017 12:29:35 GMT -5
OHSAA Adj enrollment - For current SBC schools and schools that border SBC school districts Bay 253 - Port Clinton 234 - Vermilion 208 - Edison 207 - Huron 197 - Oak Harbor 169 - Willard
River 153 - Lakota 137 - Gibsonburg 133 - Margaretta 104 - Hopewell-Loudon 70 - Tiffin Calvert 67 - Sandusky St Mary 63 - Fremont St Joe 56 - Danbury
Schools that border current SBC school districts and might be persuaded to join. 201 - Fostoria 186 - Genoa 180 - Eastwood 157 - Elmwood 150 - Woodmore 134 - Carey 125 - Seneca East 112 - Mohawk 73 - Arcadia ^^^ If Willard doesn't to be the smallest Bay team then they need to after 4 of these schools so that each Division gets to 8 football schools, and they get PC and Vermilion bumped up to the Lake Division.
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Post by 1percenter on Sept 4, 2017 12:38:24 GMT -5
Possible SBC of the future Lake 420 - Tiffin Columbian 338 - Norwalk 320 - Clyde 317 - Sandusky 282 - Perkins 267 - Bellevue 253 - Port Clinton 234 - Vermilion
Bay 208 - Edison 207 - Huron 197 - Oak Harbor 169 - Willard 153 - Lakota 150 - Woodmore 137 - Gibsonburg 133 - Margaretta
River 134 - Carey 125 - Seneca East 112 - Mohawk 104 - Hopewell-Loudon 70 - Tiffin Calvert 67 - Sandusky St Mary 63 - Fremont St Joe 56 - Danbury
Then we'd probably have Vermilion crying.
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Post by kingmartinez on Sept 4, 2017 15:04:05 GMT -5
In addition, enrollment is not the only factor that is used (i.e. Shelby/Vermilion). Really? I was told that was. Boys enrollment only for football and total enrollment for all other sports. That's not correct? It's the primary factor but other things are considered (geography, rivalries, etc.).
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Post by kingmartinez on Sept 4, 2017 15:05:12 GMT -5
Lakota will never be in the Bay. Willard is the obvious move then when/if it will be Margaretta despite any counts. They are already in the Bay for other sports. In addition, enrollment is not the only factor that is used (i.e. Shelby/Vermilion). Seems to me that if Willard & Margaretta want to avoid the shuffle they need to start beating that drum to get Genoa & Firelands into the conference sooner rather than later. Agreed. Willard is all but a done deal. It's where they wanted to be when this started. They've seen it coming since the start although they have warmed to the River football arrangement.
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footballfan
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Post by footballfan on Sept 4, 2017 15:27:04 GMT -5
Possible SBC of the future Lake 420 - Tiffin Columbian 338 - Norwalk 320 - Clyde 317 - Sandusky 282 - Perkins 267 - Bellevue 253 - Port Clinton 234 - Vermilion Bay 208 - Edison 207 - Huron 197 - Oak Harbor 169 - Willard 153 - Lakota 150 - Woodmore 137 - Gibsonburg 133 - Margaretta River 134 - Carey 125 - Seneca East 112 - Mohawk 104 - Hopewell-Loudon 70 - Tiffin Calvert 67 - Sandusky St Mary 63 - Fremont St Joe 56 - Danbury Then we'd probably have Vermilion crying. And Port Clinton. Neither team willing to play cross over games let alone be in the LAKE (majority NOL teams).
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2112
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Post by 2112 on Sept 4, 2017 16:31:04 GMT -5
Possible SBC of the future Lake 420 - Tiffin Columbian 338 - Norwalk 320 - Clyde 317 - Sandusky 282 - Perkins 267 - Bellevue 253 - Port Clinton 234 - Vermilion Bay 208 - Edison 207 - Huron 197 - Oak Harbor 169 - Willard 153 - Lakota 150 - Woodmore 137 - Gibsonburg 133 - Margaretta River 134 - Carey 125 - Seneca East 112 - Mohawk 104 - Hopewell-Loudon 70 - Tiffin Calvert 67 - Sandusky St Mary 63 - Fremont St Joe 56 - Danbury Then we'd probably have Vermilion crying. And Port Clinton. Neither team willing to play cross over games let alone be in the LAKE (majority NOL teams). Seems to me the writings are on the wall for PC & Vermilion... they better start beating that drum for Ross and one more big (Upper?)... If anyone ever told me Edison might eventually be the biggest school in the Bay I'd've thunk they were crazy.
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footballfan
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Post by footballfan on Sept 4, 2017 17:06:26 GMT -5
Good point 2112. Maybe they add three to the lake and Bellevue can go down to the bay with the other division IV teams that won't play them other then Shelby!?!? LOL
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2112
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Post by 2112 on Sept 4, 2017 17:15:55 GMT -5
Good point 2112. Maybe they add three to the lake and Bellevue can go down to the bay with the other division IV teams that won't play them other then Shelby!?!? LOL Galion might be a good choice, especially if Upper comes along. But I'm not seeing why Bellevue needs to beat up on smaller teams to make a name a la Willard...
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footballfan
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Post by footballfan on Sept 4, 2017 17:33:16 GMT -5
Beat up on smaller teams. We play all division III schools in the Lake and no division IV teams will play us in cross over games from the bay so now we drive cross country to get five none league games. The great SBC (that was 7 teams and now 21) should try to reason with all schools not just the old SBC teams and make it a great league with cross overs games that make sense. Again this is just my opinion I don't need to hear from the big mouths that we came to them. It cost schools to travel!!!!!!!!!!
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2112
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Post by 2112 on Sept 4, 2017 17:58:48 GMT -5
Beat up on smaller teams. We play all division III schools in the Lake and no division IV teams will play us in cross over games from the bay so now we drive cross country to get five none league games. The great SBC (that was 7 teams and now 21) should try to reason with all schools not just the old SBC teams and make it a great league with cross overs games that make sense. Again this is just my opinion I don't need to hear from the big mouths that we came to them. It cost schools to travel!!!!!!!!!! Maybe we should get Amherst Steele to join the Lake... they're not too far down the road...
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Sept 4, 2017 18:49:36 GMT -5
Good point 2112. Maybe they add three to the lake and Bellevue can go down to the bay with the other division IV teams that won't play them other then Shelby!?!? LOL Galion might be a good choice, especially if Upper comes along. But I'm not seeing why Bellevue needs to beat up on smaller teams to make a name a la Willard... If the SBC didn't want to travel to Ontario, they won't want Galion or Upper. If a school leaves the N-10 Willard leaves for the N-10 in the blink of an eye.
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Post by kingmartinez on Sept 4, 2017 19:58:02 GMT -5
The Bay schools should be most concerned. They wanted this set up and they got it. The schools who could realistically go elsewhere are all Bay schools (Shelby was first, in future could be Willard, Oak Harbor, Vermilion). Could this turn into a two-division conference in the future?
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2112
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Post by 2112 on Sept 4, 2017 20:01:06 GMT -5
Galion might be a good choice, especially if Upper comes along. But I'm not seeing why Bellevue needs to beat up on smaller teams to make a name a la Willard... If the SBC didn't want to travel to Ontario, they won't want Galion or Upper. If a school leaves the N-10 Willard leaves for the N-10 in the blink of an eye. The N10 has an opening... there are only 9 schools in it now. And yet Willard stands pat...
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Post by BellevueBuckeye on Sept 4, 2017 20:11:46 GMT -5
Though with Ridgedale pulling their FB program from N10 play, the N10 now has the perfect number of 8 schools playing football. Why would they want to go back to having an odd number?
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Post by Willard Fillmore on Sept 4, 2017 20:19:27 GMT -5
If the SBC didn't want to travel to Ontario, they won't want Galion or Upper. If a school leaves the N-10 Willard leaves for the N-10 in the blink of an eye. The N10 has an opening... there are only 9 schools in it now. And yet Willard stands pat... They only have 8 schools playing football, if a school leaves they're down to 7. Do the research.
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Post by GHS 1999 on Sept 4, 2017 20:29:20 GMT -5
Correct. If Seneca East leaves the N10 for the SBC then Willard would likely be the replacement. The N10 didn't take Willard before likely because they knew Ridgedale's situation and they were wise not to add anyone else at that time. There is no way Galion or Upper joins the SBC.
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Post by kniteflyer on Sept 4, 2017 20:36:11 GMT -5
Btw, it was just one guy that was complaining about the lack of cross-over games for Bellevue. Don't let one guy speak for an entire community. I like the schedule This. Annoying that this topic keeps coming up on here due to one fan that just won't let it go. Because it's the M.O. of that annoying little wannabe to whine. (Not you, this time, Hoss)
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Post by greenman on Sept 4, 2017 20:55:11 GMT -5
Beat up on smaller teams. We play all division III schools in the Lake and no division IV teams will play us in cross over games from the bay so now we drive cross country to get five none league games. The great SBC (that was 7 teams and now 21) should try to reason with all schools not just the old SBC teams and make it a great league with cross overs games that make sense. Again this is just my opinion I don't need to hear from the big mouths that we came to them. It cost schools to travel!!!!!!!!!! Will this help, user of unnecessary multiple exclamation points?
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Post by greenman on Sept 4, 2017 21:09:31 GMT -5
Someone please explain how the six-person difference in boys' enrollments (according to OHSAA Member Dir.) accounts for the divisional difference between Bellevue (D IV) and Perkins (D III) in FB? Are they really that close to the line? Here I was sure Perkins was the smallest by enrollment in Lake Div.
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Post by gridiron58 on Sept 5, 2017 5:17:01 GMT -5
Someone please explain how the six-person difference in boys' enrollments (according to OHSAA Member Dir.) accounts for the divisional difference between Bellevue (D IV) and Perkins (D III) in FB? Are they really that close to the line? Here I was sure Perkins was the smallest by enrollment in Lake Div. Because they have to set the line somewhere, they try to make each division as close to the same number of schools as possible. If your above the line your Div 3 if your below your 4. I'm sure there are schools within one of the cutoff and if they move the number one spot another school will be within one of the cutoff.
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